Benevolent Societycalls the afternoon with dementia patients as prone to the Sundowner effect. Mornings are much better. After struggling through a phone conversation with my friend with dementia this afternoon, I agree. repetitive was not the word. I was told the same thing over and over and he was otherwise quite out of things.
Not only does afternoon affect lucidity but also makes those with dementia less amenable. I saw this with Dad as well as now with my friend. The general effort of living and putting on a good front affects the ability to be amenable.
One of the earlier signs of dementia is an increase in argumentative times even over very minor things. Dad was very quiet, very polite but as time went on, easily disturbed. Same with my friend who is determined he will never leave his lifelong home. However, the time is approaching when we will have to consider such a move. Over his dead body, as he says.
My mother had dementia from her Parkinsons. Her dementia did vary throughout the day, but I believe it was partially due to which medications were given at different times. My sister, with whom she lived, would suggest when it would be a good time to call if I wanted any sort of lucidity.
Also, as Lothlorien mentions above, an increase in argumentative times was certainly true for my mother as well as my father, whose dementia was Alzheimers-caused.
(You'll notice my genes aren't real promising -- a mother with Parkinsons and a father with Alzheimers. My sister avoided the whole dementia situation by dying of heart failure at 63.)
My hairdresser's daughter, who works in the care industry, says it's acknowledged that some people have morning dementia while for others it's afternoon or evening dementia!
At any event and against all expectations, The Dowager did really well by cooing over and admiring her great-granddaughter, recognising her grandson and his wife, and asking all the right questions about his mother-in-law (who has met The Dowager on various occasions). Full marks to all of them <happy dance>.
I told him that I would be a happy old lady if my grandchildren cared about me the way he does for The Dowager
@Pigwidgeon - my mother and my grandmother both had/have dementia. I console myself by saying that both were long-term smokers - and besides, I am more like my father, who died with a massive heart attack at 55. I've survived him by 13 years so I refuse to be dispirited. Genes aren't everything.
@NOprophet_NØprofit , sorry to hear about your father. Hope you can find a way forward that gives him the best quality of life. @Lothlorien, does anyone have the Australian equivalent of Power of Attorney for when difficult deductions about your friend’s care have to be made? @The Intrepid Mrs S glad your son had a good visit to your mother.
Getting irrationally cross was something my mum was doing more often, but it took a while for me to see that as a sign of dementia. Mum is definitely worse in the afternoon, but no longer makes a great deal of sense any time of the day.
There are six of us, all old friends who keep an eye on him. Two have joint enduring PoA and also enduring guardianship which covers medical matters. We could see him sliding down a slippery slope, but he refused any help. It took months to get this set up. He was very reluctant to do anything, not even make a will. We were very fortunate he had a good day when the two went with him to solicitor to get this arranged and fortunate that it was at the beginning of the illness without a medical diagnosis at the time. That came later. The solicitor knew him from dealings with his dad, and judged him competent, which he was at the time, to make the agreements.
@Pigwidgeon - my mother and my grandmother both had/have dementia. I console myself by saying that both were long-term smokers - and besides, I am more like my father, who died with a massive heart attack at 55. I've survived him by 13 years so I refuse to be dispirited. Genes aren't everything.
Mrs. S, feeling cheerful
Thanks, Mrs. S.! I have already reached beyond the age at which both of my parents were showing signs of dementia, and I take heart in that. (My father smoked when I was very young. My mother, sister, and I never did.)
I'm planning, in about five years, to move to a lovely retirement facility nearby. I will have to pass a mental evaluation before they'll take me. Once I'm there, however, they'll keep me for the rest of my life, moving me to assisted living, memory care, or full care if it becomes necessary. So I at least have to fend off dementia until then!
Gee, Pigwidgeon, that is motivation in the extreme!
My mom had an aunt and an uncle who both lived long lives and were cheerful but had no short term memory for about twenty years. She favoured both of them and had quite a fear of finding herself in the same situation. In her last few weeks, a beautiful look came over her face and she turned to tell me that she had just realized that she never had to worry about dementia ever again. We decided that that was one of the only good things about cancer.
To my surprise Mrs Z has voluntarily trundled off into respite and assessment care for a few days.
Many years ago when we were at this stage with my Dad, he went to local mid-mountains hospital for a few days of assessment. He hated it.
Hospital rang mum to say he had disappeared. He could not be found anywhere, so police were notified.
A young constable approached dad on the local railway station. A considerable walk from the hospital but nothing for dad who for years had walked many miles every day. He had bought a pensioner concession ticket and would have boarded the first train to arrive from either direction. He would have ended up in the city which would have been terrible or at Lithgow or Bathurst out west.
Dad was very cranky with policeman. He insisted he had caught train many times from North Sydney station, the northern end of the bridge. As a teacher he had to travel home with school pupils from swimming at North Sydney pool. We were grateful, not cranky.
I'm having a bit of a difficult time at the moment. And this is when I really miss my mum. On a good day sitting with her is very peaceful, but she's got no idea what I'm going through at the moment. She's still alive, but I miss her.
That is heartbreaking double-duty, to love when hope of restoration is gone and and find no solace in return. I hope that you are finding ways to be kind to yourself, and that there are supportive friends around you.
No-one can replace your mum of course, and it is unbelievably hard watching a parent fade away and yet linger on. I hope that you find peace and comfort, and a way through your troubles in time.
I agree @Robert Armin , I look very enviously at mothers and daughters out shopping, something mum and I used to enjoy. I can still take her out, but it's more like being with a toddler. On the last trip out she kept on deciding she wanted random things and then changed her mind, and I had to be very aware where the nearest loo was. @zappa, how's your mum enjoying her respite stay. I think booking yourself in must make the whole thing a bit easier. Another resident of mum's care home and I got told off for chatting too loudly when a group of school children were doing a display. Like Mrs Z she'd booked herself in and was still able to take herself out for a walk or to the shops. She did say she left like she was in a 'looney bin' at times, and I can see why, but on the whole she seemed happy.
Sounds like Mr. Lamb, who was sitting in a wheelchair in the emergency room when he found himself ministering to a fellow patient... They never retire.
Sorry the visit was hard @Robert Armin . Have you had a chat to the staff about how she is when you're not there? I often find it difficult to stay long with my mum, forty minutes sounds like a decent amount of time for a visit.
@zappa, how's your mum enjoying her respite stay. I think booking yourself in must make the whole thing a bit easier. Another resident of mum's care home and I got told off for chatting too loudly when a group of school children were doing a display. Like Mrs Z she'd booked herself in and was still able to take herself out for a walk or to the shops. She did say she left like she was in a 'looney bin' at times, and I can see why, but on the whole she seemed happy.
Haven't heard for a few days. In some ways she acquiesced rather than booked herself in - I gave the wrong impression. The ambos were sick of her trying to gain frequent fliers by taking fall after fall.
Well I had one of the more bizarre afternoons of my life on Thursday when I went with mum and a few other residents of her care home to see Pricilla, Queen of the Desert at a local theatre. One lady in a wheelchair was saying 'help I'm being kidnapped' all the way there, I think that might have been a joke, and several others, including mum, seemed a bit confused about where we were off too. The show was fun, but because of needing wheelchair seats we were right at the side so couldn't see everything. That was a bit useless for mum who has very poor eyesight. The acoustics were grim, so though it was loud I couldn't make out 80% of what was said (perils of severe hearing loss). I knew all the songs, which was more than mum did, as they were mostly 80s disco classics. Everyone cheered up a the break when we all had prosecco, wine and ice cream and mum gave it a standing ovation at the end. The main thing I took away from it was that women of a certain age seem to love drag. We talked to several other ladies there and they had all seen the show a few times.
That reminds me of the shock I had at mum's home a few weeks ago. I overheard the staff planning a film night, and I thought I heard them say they would be showing "Reservoir Dogs". It turned out to be "Cats and Dogs".....
Robert Armin You may have been having your own "senior moment".
Just throwing this out there, as someone who has lost both parents now and has no more aging parents but who visits nursing homes regularly, sometimes I think it is healthy to think about what your mother or father might be thinking or saying to you if they were to be able to communicate fully and without the whole adult/child thing going on. At some point in time, we all likely came to the realization that our mommy and daddy were people long before we came along. When I meet people in the nursing home who have no history with me, I seem to be able to take them at face value and chat about current things - whether they are able to reply or not - and relate the things that I have been doing or am going to do to things I know about the past. Now, I have a dog with me and they pretty much all enjoy her so are "up" when I am there, but I do notice that their mood changes quite suddenly when I talk about having lots of laundry to do when I get home and that I am thankful that we're not still in the times of washtubs and wringer washers and full clotheslines. I can often get them chatting about what they used to do and stories come out. If not, I relate the stories I heard from the last person and at least get a nod or a knowing smile. I know that it must be so painful for the family members to see their moms and dads "failing". I wish there was a way to ease that by having them see that their parents wouldn't want them to lose sleep over their distress. If I wind up in a nursing home, I sure hope that I am as open to what is happening to me as are the people that I visit. Sorry if this sounds rant-like. I don't mean it that way. I just have this feeling that our parents wouldn't want us to be suffering. It is hard to go through various stages of life and anything we can do to make the last stages easier is totally worth it.
Mum is back in the hospital. This time she has been vomiting including blood and since being in has managed to fall getting out of bed so is now needing x-rays to check she has not broken anything. She is requiring one to one nursing.
Dad will want to visit, so brief plan is that I should try and take him tomorrow.
Relationships with parents can vary alot. The mythology of closeness, being your father's son, mum's home cooking- stuff like that. All of it false for me. I was in boarding school and saw little of my parents in my teens. Then 10 years of post secondary education, marrying, a bit of contact, not happy nor satisfying. They moved to Mexico the month our eldest was born, we saw them for 2 weeks every second year. They didn't like visitors and the village they lived in was third world conditions: bad water, smells of decay, desert in the centre of the country. I bailed my father out and repatriated him after my mother died, now 10 years of looking after him. He's got another cancer surgery in a few weeks, blind old man. If there's something I've learned its to gird your family and friends to your soul with hoops of steel and don't isolate, foist yourself on others, let them to you. Many choices are your's to live with and you've got to make what there is be as good as possible. Some don't deserve what they get. It's at the stage now that when this 91 year old goes, he get the funeral he says he doesn't want; but it's the least I can do to overrule, my mother refused us to visit before she died and I should have been more assertive which might have had be arrive uninvited 2 days or months before she died instead of 2 days after. Joyful joyful we adore thee, because I like the tune.
It's hard when oeople won't let you love them. I'm going to visit my folks (family wedding) but though it's less than a week, I know from the past that my mother will be wishing me gone very quickly. She just doesn't like visitors, whoever they might be.
Mrs Zappa is still being held, as it were, for assessment. She is no longer excited at the fuss being made of her - bloody angry comes to mind. Had a fall yesterday, blamed everyone else, though with some recognition that she drove the walker into a corner and "it tipped me over."
My youngest daughter is flying in from Australia to see her today ... a saintly visit, but I hope it is not too much of a shock for her. She hasn't seen her for several years.
As yet there is no release plan on the hospital notes.
Amen to that. I think in my case my mother is angry with me for not being nearer, but won't tell me. She retaliates by not telling me anything of her reality, and by deflecting my questions. She has the occasional moments of openness if I visit, but only a few....
I'm no genius about these things, but I'm on the side of never letting up on trying. And not letting the past experiences dictate what I'll do in the future. It's one of the very annoying things about Christianity, is that giving up on people isn't an option (at least that's my interpretation of it). When my father doesn't talk, I do. I tell him things I've told him before. In his case, about jazz music, which I have learned about so as to engage him in something that gives him pleasure to talk about. It's probably *bad* to feed into self-centredness, but it makes him smile, and he'll then talk happily for a few minutes. Is that love, at least sort of between us? For me it either is or I am happier in my delusion than without. (I've learned I have the capacity to make him cry as I have cried, but that's a Very Bad Sintm I think, to enjoy returning suffering.)
Yesterday I was told that my mum is declining rapidly, and probably only has weeks to live. It may be 4, it may be 24, but not long now. When I said I'd been feeling she wouldn't be here for Christmas, the staff said they thought I was right.
Even though they were only saying what I was thinking, it was a shock to hear this. Still, I'll make the most of the time that is left.
The Telemum has to have Furosemide (a diuretic) to get her leg ulcer to heal. It became intolerable some months ago, and they took her off it, but now she's been back on it for a few weeks.
She also has high blood pressure. She kept getting dizzy and uncertain on her feet, called the doctor, they put her back on blood pressure meds.
Dizzy spells got worse, plus blurred vision, to the point where she got the doctor in last Sunday. He said blood pressure was perfect, the dizziness was from orthostatic hypotension, so stand up slowly and drink lots of water to keep her blood pressure *up*. She accordingly chugs loads of water, eats 4 small meals a day.
On Monday another doctor told her she has chicken pox. Acyclovir finally arrived yesterday, FWIW.
So since yesterday (but before Acyclovir) she's getting so many dizzy spells she can't do a thing with it. She has been here before, with too much blood pressure meds. Solution: take her off meds. Blood pressure goes back up. Rinse and repeat.
So her blood pressure is high and low simultaneously? Furosemide? What???
I can't even. Has anyone dealt with this perchance? Can't help thinking she'd be better off without these meds, but what do I know. I can hear her on the phone now. Hoping she gets some useful advice.
How could it not be love, to put yourself out to provide him a few minutes of pleasure? That’s awesome.
Indeed. People talk about living in the "now". Folks with dementia really do. Every moment of happiness is important even if they forget it five minutes later. It's real and important. Bless you, NpNp.
Every moment of happiness is important even if they forget it five minutes later. It's real and important. Bless you, NpNp.
I had to tell my brother this just a couple of days ago. His F-i-L had his 100th birthday, and the family had a little party in his care-home. Its a large, Irish, family, so it was a jolly party, but my brother was wondering what the point was, as F-i-L would have forgotten it the next day, or sooner.
The point was that he enjoyed it at the time, and felt the love centred on him, even if he forgot who, when or why.
I agree. Being with mum is still wonderful, even though every time I turn up she is surprised. Those moments with her are very precious.
I had a particularly wonderful experience yesterday. The staff told me she has been saying, "Look after my son". So, at some level, she knows she is dying, and still wants me to be cared for.
Just a thought, consider putting a sign up over the head of her bed saying to all who care for her to remind her that her son is well looked after and loves her dearly. Anyone who comes in will know to tell her that and you can be sure that it will bring her comfort since you know she has spoken of it. If there are others who are dear to her, add their names too.
Comments
One of the earlier signs of dementia is an increase in argumentative times even over very minor things. Dad was very quiet, very polite but as time went on, easily disturbed. Same with my friend who is determined he will never leave his lifelong home. However, the time is approaching when we will have to consider such a move. Over his dead body, as he says.
Also, as Lothlorien mentions above, an increase in argumentative times was certainly true for my mother as well as my father, whose dementia was Alzheimers-caused.
(You'll notice my genes aren't real promising -- a mother with Parkinsons and a father with Alzheimers. My sister avoided the whole dementia situation by dying of heart failure at 63.)
At any event and against all expectations, The Dowager did really well by cooing over and admiring her great-granddaughter, recognising her grandson and his wife, and asking all the right questions about his mother-in-law (who has met The Dowager on various occasions). Full marks to all of them <happy dance>.
I told him that I would be a happy old lady if my grandchildren cared about me the way he does for The Dowager
@Pigwidgeon - my mother and my grandmother both had/have dementia. I console myself by saying that both were long-term smokers - and besides, I am more like my father, who died with a massive heart attack at 55. I've survived him by 13 years so I refuse to be dispirited. Genes aren't everything.
Mrs. S, feeling cheerful
@Lothlorien, does anyone have the Australian equivalent of Power of Attorney for when difficult deductions about your friend’s care have to be made?
@The Intrepid Mrs S glad your son had a good visit to your mother.
Getting irrationally cross was something my mum was doing more often, but it took a while for me to see that as a sign of dementia. Mum is definitely worse in the afternoon, but no longer makes a great deal of sense any time of the day.
Thanks, Mrs. S.! I have already reached beyond the age at which both of my parents were showing signs of dementia, and I take heart in that. (My father smoked when I was very young. My mother, sister, and I never did.)
I'm planning, in about five years, to move to a lovely retirement facility nearby. I will have to pass a mental evaluation before they'll take me. Once I'm there, however, they'll keep me for the rest of my life, moving me to assisted living, memory care, or full care if it becomes necessary. So I at least have to fend off dementia until then!
My mom had an aunt and an uncle who both lived long lives and were cheerful but had no short term memory for about twenty years. She favoured both of them and had quite a fear of finding herself in the same situation. In her last few weeks, a beautiful look came over her face and she turned to tell me that she had just realized that she never had to worry about dementia ever again. We decided that that was one of the only good things about cancer.
Many years ago when we were at this stage with my Dad, he went to local mid-mountains hospital for a few days of assessment. He hated it.
Hospital rang mum to say he had disappeared. He could not be found anywhere, so police were notified.
A young constable approached dad on the local railway station. A considerable walk from the hospital but nothing for dad who for years had walked many miles every day. He had bought a pensioner concession ticket and would have boarded the first train to arrive from either direction. He would have ended up in the city which would have been terrible or at Lithgow or Bathurst out west.
Dad was very cranky with policeman. He insisted he had caught train many times from North Sydney station, the northern end of the bridge. As a teacher he had to travel home with school pupils from swimming at North Sydney pool. We were grateful, not cranky.
That is heartbreaking double-duty, to love when hope of restoration is gone and and find no solace in return. I hope that you are finding ways to be kind to yourself, and that there are supportive friends around you.
No-one can replace your mum of course, and it is unbelievably hard watching a parent fade away and yet linger on. I hope that you find peace and comfort, and a way through your troubles in time.
@zappa, how's your mum enjoying her respite stay. I think booking yourself in must make the whole thing a bit easier. Another resident of mum's care home and I got told off for chatting too loudly when a group of school children were doing a display. Like Mrs Z she'd booked herself in and was still able to take herself out for a walk or to the shops. She did say she left like she was in a 'looney bin' at times, and I can see why, but on the whole she seemed happy.
Now just to get a service book to him so he is prepared for the next time
I know there is no
Haven't heard for a few days. In some ways she acquiesced rather than booked herself in - I gave the wrong impression. The ambos were sick of her trying to gain frequent fliers by taking fall after fall.
But yeah, no news is no news, pretty much.
[candle]
Just throwing this out there, as someone who has lost both parents now and has no more aging parents but who visits nursing homes regularly, sometimes I think it is healthy to think about what your mother or father might be thinking or saying to you if they were to be able to communicate fully and without the whole adult/child thing going on. At some point in time, we all likely came to the realization that our mommy and daddy were people long before we came along. When I meet people in the nursing home who have no history with me, I seem to be able to take them at face value and chat about current things - whether they are able to reply or not - and relate the things that I have been doing or am going to do to things I know about the past. Now, I have a dog with me and they pretty much all enjoy her so are "up" when I am there, but I do notice that their mood changes quite suddenly when I talk about having lots of laundry to do when I get home and that I am thankful that we're not still in the times of washtubs and wringer washers and full clotheslines. I can often get them chatting about what they used to do and stories come out. If not, I relate the stories I heard from the last person and at least get a nod or a knowing smile. I know that it must be so painful for the family members to see their moms and dads "failing". I wish there was a way to ease that by having them see that their parents wouldn't want them to lose sleep over their distress. If I wind up in a nursing home, I sure hope that I am as open to what is happening to me as are the people that I visit. Sorry if this sounds rant-like. I don't mean it that way. I just have this feeling that our parents wouldn't want us to be suffering. It is hard to go through various stages of life and anything we can do to make the last stages easier is totally worth it.
Dad will want to visit, so brief plan is that I should try and take him tomorrow.
Candles for NPNP and LC.
No. A broken leg on top of this comes in as further down the list.
My youngest daughter is flying in from Australia to see her today ... a saintly visit, but I hope it is not too much of a shock for her. She hasn't seen her for several years.
As yet there is no release plan on the hospital notes.
Amen to that. I think in my case my mother is angry with me for not being nearer, but won't tell me. She retaliates by not telling me anything of her reality, and by deflecting my questions. She has the occasional moments of openness if I visit, but only a few....
I read that as 'you and your repetitive APs'.
I think I was right!
Even though they were only saying what I was thinking, it was a shock to hear this. Still, I'll make the most of the time that is left.
The Telemum has to have Furosemide (a diuretic) to get her leg ulcer to heal. It became intolerable some months ago, and they took her off it, but now she's been back on it for a few weeks.
She also has high blood pressure. She kept getting dizzy and uncertain on her feet, called the doctor, they put her back on blood pressure meds.
Dizzy spells got worse, plus blurred vision, to the point where she got the doctor in last Sunday. He said blood pressure was perfect, the dizziness was from orthostatic hypotension, so stand up slowly and drink lots of water to keep her blood pressure *up*. She accordingly chugs loads of water, eats 4 small meals a day.
On Monday another doctor told her she has chicken pox. Acyclovir finally arrived yesterday, FWIW.
So since yesterday (but before Acyclovir) she's getting so many dizzy spells she can't do a thing with it. She has been here before, with too much blood pressure meds. Solution: take her off meds. Blood pressure goes back up. Rinse and repeat.
So her blood pressure is high and low simultaneously? Furosemide? What???
I can't even. Has anyone dealt with this perchance? Can't help thinking she'd be better off without these meds, but what do I know. I can hear her on the phone now. Hoping she gets some useful advice.
Prayers ascending for you and the Telemum, and for Robert Armin and his mum.
Indeed. People talk about living in the "now". Folks with dementia really do. Every moment of happiness is important even if they forget it five minutes later. It's real and important. Bless you, NpNp.
The point was that he enjoyed it at the time, and felt the love centred on him, even if he forgot who, when or why.
I had a particularly wonderful experience yesterday. The staff told me she has been saying, "Look after my son". So, at some level, she knows she is dying, and still wants me to be cared for.
Just a thought, consider putting a sign up over the head of her bed saying to all who care for her to remind her that her son is well looked after and loves her dearly. Anyone who comes in will know to tell her that and you can be sure that it will bring her comfort since you know she has spoken of it. If there are others who are dear to her, add their names too.