Purgatory: Oops - your Trump presidency discussion thread.

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  • The public SAYS it hates negative ads. That doesn't really come out in the way they vote though.
  • Gramps49Gramps49 Shipmate
    edited April 2018
    Amanda wrote:
    Meanwhile, in Arizona's special election to fill the Congressional seat vacated by the resignation of Trent Franks, Republican Debbie Lesko narrowly defeated Democrat Hiral Tipirneni in a district that in 2016 heavily went for the person who eventually was to occupy the White House.

    True, the margin was 5.2% Trump had won that district by 21%. Considering this will again be re-run in just a few months, come November, it may be a different result.
  • Simon ToadSimon Toad Shipmate
    edited April 2018
    I hear Cohen has taken the fifth in the action Stephanie Clifford took against him. As I understand it, that means he believes that if he tells the truth, he has a substantive fear that he will implicate himself in the commission of a crime.

    Badabing badaboom! Looks like you can't ask Michael Mr Trump.

    In other news I recommend Judy Woodruff's interview of what's-her-name, Sally Yeates. Two women at the top of their game having a long chat about very substantive matters. In fact, the Newshour today was very interesting in its entirety.
  • LydaLyda Shipmate
    Boogie wrote: »
    trump uses icky touch a great deal in public, even on state occasions. I can’t imagine what he’s like in private.

    :whereisthethrowingupsmiliewhenineedit:

    Melania has the balls to brush off his attempts to hold her hand in public. I imagine their sex life is a bit lacking these days.
  • OhherOhher Shipmate
    Any sexual activity including 44.2 as one partner will inevitably be dismal.
  • Barnabas62Barnabas62 Shipmate, Host Emeritus
    Does that matter? What matters is that he's a serial adulterer who exploits his fame.
  • Bishops FingerBishops Finger Shipmate
    edited April 2018
    BBC News reveals the glad tidings of POTUS' visit to the UK:
    bbc.co.uk/news/uk-43913414

    Friday 13th July.
    :grimace:

    O deep joy. Not.

    IJ
  • CrœsosCrœsos Shipmate
    BBC News reveals the glad tidings of POTUS' visit to the UK:
    bbc.co.uk/news/uk-43913414

    Friday 13th July.

    Could be problematic for more than one reason.
    I don’t believe in ghosts because, if there were such a thing, then I think the following would be a true story. As far as I know, it is not. …

    It’s not widely discussed. Those who have witnessed it firsthand are, for obvious reasons, reluctant to talk about it. You’ll never see them publicly recounting their tales in front of the cameras and the microphones. These aren’t stories they are eager to tell.

    But one hears whispers, rumors, stories told by the friends of friends. And those whispers, rumors and stories are too numerous and too eerily similar to be dismissed.

    Something is happening. Something, it seems, happens every Friday the 13th, just before midnight.

    Read on for why Trump might have a particular reason to worry about this specific ghost story.
  • BBC News reveals the glad tidings of POTUS' visit to the UK:
    bbc.co.uk/news/uk-43913414

    Friday 13th July.
    :grimace:

    O deep joy. Not.

    IJ

    This could go one of two ways:

    a) England exceed all expectations at the World Cup and so the populace will be so fixated about the forthcoming World Cup Final on July 15th that no-one pays any attention to Trump at all.

    b) England fulfil all expectations, crashing out before the Quarter Finals. Populace is grumpy and looking for someone to take it out on. Enter Trump!

    Seriously, the only question will be just how many people there will be demonstrating on the streets. As it is July and so a good chance of decent weather, I am guessing that we will be talking about over a million. I think that we ought to run a Ship Sweepstake, and see whose estimate gets nearest the "official" figure.
  • I thought England was boycotting the World Cup from the second round.

    I read that tale Croesos. I must say I do not like Frederick Douglass being used in that way. I feel its disrespectful, but this is my initial reaction. The only thing I can say with certainty about the story is that it disturbs me.

    Do people think that the Senate really had no option but to confirm Pompeo because he was one of the few Americans to shake hands with the Korean dictator? Was it him or Rodman?
  • I think that we ought to run a Ship Sweepstake, and see whose estimate gets nearest the "official" figure.

    I'll put my money on it being the bigliest crowd ever!

    :wink:
  • LydaLyda Shipmate
    Boris Johnson Tweeted: FANTASTIC news that President @realdonaldtrump will at last come to Britain on 13 July. Looking forward to seeing our closest ally and friend on the GREATest visit ever.
  • LydaLyda Shipmate
    Aaargh! My question dropped off after I previewed it. I repeat: "This is hilarious! Did Boris mean it to be hilarious?"
  • BoogieBoogie Heaven Host
    I’m going out for the day on media blackout.
  • Lyda wrote: »
    Aaargh! My question dropped off after I previewed it. I repeat: "This is hilarious! Did Boris mean it to be hilarious?"

    I think he probably did. He's bright, self-serving, and has cultivated a 'bumbling idiot' persona beneath which he fiddles with the levers of power. I was going to say perhaps he's like a bright version of Trump (for whom there's presumably only the idiot exterior, with nothing going on behind the public persona) but that's silly - it could mean anything.

  • mousethief wrote: »
    The public SAYS it hates negative ads. That doesn't really come out in the way they vote though.

    They hate negative ads against their side. They cheer negative ads against the other side.
  • Because they're true!
  • Meanwhile, over in The Koreas, Mr. Kim and Mr. Moon seem to be getting along famously. Which is good to hear, of course.

    bbc.co.uk/news

    Is it all window-dressing, or am I right in thinking that, once again, POTUS is being upstaged by statesmen of greater acumen? FWIW, I don't believe Mr. Kim is anyone's fool.

    Neither are Mr. Xi, Mr. Putin, or M. Macron. I'm not too sure about our own dear BoJo the Clown, mind. That 'bumbling idiot' persona cleverly conceals a bumbling idiot...

    IJ
  • CrœsosCrœsos Shipmate
    So there's this:
    Donald J. Trump
    @realDonaldTrump

    The U.S. has put together a STRONG bid w/ Canada & Mexico for the 2026 World Cup. It would be a shame if countries that we always support were to lobby against the U.S. bid. Why should we be supporting these countries when they don’t support us (including at the United Nations)?

    "It would be a shame . . . "?!? Well, he seems to have finally found the right balance of cliché, sleaze, and gangster movie that he's been going for.
  • Simon Toad wrote: »
    I thought England was boycotting the World Cup from the second round.
    Half-assed move if you ask me. We in the States are boycotting the whole thing.
    Crœsos wrote: »
    So there's this:
    Donald J. Trump
    @realDonaldTrump

    The U.S. has put together a STRONG bid w/ Canada & Mexico for the 2026 World Cup. It would be a shame if countries that we always support were to lobby against the U.S. bid. Why should we be supporting these countries when they don’t support us (including at the United Nations)?

    "It would be a shame . . . "?!? Well, he seems to have finally found the right balance of cliché, sleaze, and gangster movie that he's been going for.

    FIFA has apparently indicated that this statement was a violation of existing ethics rules for World Cup bidding nations. Which raises a few questions. First, wait, FIFA has ethics rules? And second, how unethical do you have to be for FIFA to declare your behavior unethical?
  • CrœsosCrœsos Shipmate
    FIFA has apparently indicated that this statement was a violation of existing ethics rules for World Cup bidding nations. Which raises a few questions. First, wait, FIFA has ethics rules? And second, how unethical do you have to be for FIFA to declare your behavior unethical?

    To borrow a turn of phrase from Charlie Pierce "We talk about our sports occasionally being tinged by organized crime. International soccer actually is organized crime." Maybe that's the issue. They don't like Trump moving in on their territory.
  • Simon ToadSimon Toad Shipmate
    edited April 2018
    Well my Fox News on my Phone experiment has lasted about a month I think. Not everything that came through the feed was bad, but the bloke who tweeted support for Trump and who is on that reality TV show and the flow on from that did me in. There were regular posts about other black people saying its ok for african americans to vote republican. This is still going on. It drives me batty. Don't people remember Condoleeza Rice, or Colin Powell or even Ben Carson? I posted that it was fine for rich people to vote Republican but that poor people should vote Democrat.

    Anyway, I could feel my bile rising to a Hulk-like crescendo, so I stopped following the feed. I'm keeping Living the Bream on my podcast list for now. Everything else is gone.

    I watched that comedian at the White House Correspondents Dinner. She died in the room. Scattered laughter at best. I thought the material was good, although audience involvement can be risky in those sorts of functions. I liked her jokes about Conway and Sanders, especially the lines bouncing off The Handmaiden's Tale.
  • Simon Toad wrote: »
    but the bloke who tweeted support for Trump and who is on that reality TV show and the flow on from that did me in. There were regular posts about other black people saying its ok for african americans to vote republican. This is still going on. It drives me batty. Don't people remember Condoleeza Rice, or Colin Powell or even Ben Carson? I posted that it was fine for rich people to vote Republican but that poor people should vote Democrat.
    Kanye West isn't just some dude who married into a reality TV family. He's actually one of the undisputed greatest rappers and producers of all time. And while he does have a humongous ego, and a habit for deciding to speak up at the worst possible time, I think a handful of people really appreciated the whole "George Bush doesn't care about black people" rant (worth re-watching, if only for the growing uncomfortable look on Mike Myers' face) as a rare moment when a black celebrity actually said to white America what a lot of black people have concluded over time. So for that guy to embrace Trump in any way, or to embrace the Make America Great Again slogan, really stung, even if it is was entirely within his character.
  • mousethiefmousethief Shipmate
    edited April 2018
    I don't see how it can be in his character to speak out against Bush's treatment of blacks, and also embrace Trump. Unless his character is to say whatever he thinks will get the biggest reaction. In which case, to hell with his character, and the horse it rode in on. His character is a whore.
  • Ah yeah. Kayne West was the fellow. I knew he was a musician of a type I ignore and yet was not a heavy metal person, or a practitioner of any of the other metals. Was he the bloke who got up at some sort of awards presentation and said someone else should have won? There is NO WAY I am putting his name into a search engine. Who knows what it could do to my algorithms. It sounds like he should wield about as much political influence as Ossy Osbourne, another name that I shall not use in a search engine so that my algorithms remain unsullied.
  • Rap is one of the very few venues that young black males have in this county to express themselves in ways that society at large will hear them, and thus it has always been political at its core. I totally get it if it's not your thing. But before we dismiss black athletes or rappers as people who shouldn't wield any political influence, ask yourself how many other young black males have a venue to address white America and tell us about how they experience the world.
  • CrœsosCrœsos Shipmate
    Simon Toad wrote: »
    Ah yeah. Kayne West was the fellow. I knew he was a musician of a type I ignore and yet was not a heavy metal person, or a practitioner of any of the other metals. Was he the bloke who got up at some sort of awards presentation and said someone else should have won?

    Yeah, that was him. He thought Beyoncé should have won the 2009 MTV Best Female Video award instead of Taylor Swift. He also went on stage during the 2006 MTV Europe Music Awards during the presentation of the Best Video award and said he should have won. Kanye has a long and problematic history with awards shows.
  • Rap is one of the very few venues that young black males have in this county to express themselves in ways that society at large will hear them, and thus it has always been political at its core. I totally get it if it's not your thing. But before we dismiss black athletes or rappers as people who shouldn't wield any political influence, ask yourself how many other young black males have a venue to address white America and tell us about how they experience the world.
    But does "society at large" or "white America" listen to rap? I don't, nor do I know anyone who does (certainly no one my age). I wouldn't know Kanye if I fell over him.

  • You tell me with a straight face that Swift's "You Belong with Me" is a superior video to Beyonce's "Single Ladies." You can't. (Not that this simple and indisputable truth makes it the right move for Kanye to jump on stage, and Beyonce was beyond classy for letting Swift finish her thank-yous after Beyonce won "Video of the Year," which, somehow, she was able to win despite her video not even being the best female video, apparently. Award shows are stupid.)

    But this is part of the sting for Kanye's black fans when he seems to embrace Trump. Fox was more than happy to rake him over the coals over this incident, and to do everything it could to make him nothing more than some bloke who got up at that one awards show. His fans stood by him in that storm. So for him to now embrace the forces that did so much to dismiss him in the past stings.
  • Pigwidgeon wrote: »
    Rap is one of the very few venues that young black males have in this county to express themselves in ways that society at large will hear them, and thus it has always been political at its core. I totally get it if it's not your thing. But before we dismiss black athletes or rappers as people who shouldn't wield any political influence, ask yourself how many other young black males have a venue to address white America and tell us about how they experience the world.
    But does "society at large" or "white America" listen to rap? I don't, nor do I know anyone who does (certainly no one my age). I wouldn't know Kanye if I fell over him.

    I think it would be uncontroversial to say that Rap has been the most dominant and influential musical genre in the States for at least two decades now. I get that it doesn't have a huge following on the Ship, but it absolutely has a presence in American culture.

    A rapper just won the Pulitzer. A rap-based musical has swept the nation. Top rappers headline music festivals It's not a flash in the pan, minority genre.
  • Gramps49Gramps49 Shipmate
    Questions Mr Mueller want to ask Trump. If so, it very much looks like an obstruction of justice investigation over a collusion investigation.
  • edited May 2018
    Pigwidgeon wrote: »
    Rap is one of the very few venues that young black males have in this county to express themselves in ways that society at large will hear them, and thus it has always been political at its core. I totally get it if it's not your thing. But before we dismiss black athletes or rappers as people who shouldn't wield any political influence, ask yourself how many other young black males have a venue to address white America and tell us about how they experience the world.
    But does "society at large" or "white America" listen to rap? I don't, nor do I know anyone who does (certainly no one my age). I wouldn't know Kanye if I fell over him.

    I think it would be uncontroversial to say that Rap has been the most dominant and influential musical genre in the States for at least two decades now. I get that it doesn't have a huge following on the Ship, but it absolutely has a presence in American culture.

    A rapper just won the Pulitzer. A rap-based musical has swept the nation. Top rappers headline music festivals It's not a flash in the pan, minority genre.

    Not much of a rap fan, but like Leonard Bernstein (the conductor) said of rock and roll in 1966, most of it is forgettable, 3% is memorable and amazing. (from memory, I heard it said on CBC radio and it stuck with me).

    In terms of what rap means and signifies, I'd suggest Public Enemy's Fight the Power, which shows that since 1989 not much has really changed. (The lyrics include words some will find are NSFW, but then person the thread is about is sometimes NSFW, and certainly bad for the digestion. )
  • Martin54Martin54 Suspended
    Eutychus wrote: »
    If his credibility is totally shot with the rest of the world this might prove problematic, at least as regards foreign policy, with a possible impact on the markets.
    How could that happen?
  • The New York Times received a leak from
    Gramps49 wrote: »
    Questions Mr Mueller want to ask Trump. If so, it very much looks like an obstruction of justice investigation over a collusion investigation.
    There's plenty of collusion questions in there, although I have read similar assessments from other sources. Obstruction is probably the easier charge to prove, so maybe that's part of it.

    I've seen guesses out there that this was leaked by Trump's people, in an effort to play up the angle that they are seeking obstruction because there is no evidence of collusion. That was certainly Trump's take in his tweet this morning.
  • CrœsosCrœsos Shipmate
    Gramps49 wrote: »
    Questions Mr Mueller want to ask Trump. If so, it very much looks like an obstruction of justice investigation over a collusion investigation.
    There's plenty of collusion questions in there, although I have read similar assessments from other sources. Obstruction is probably the easier charge to prove, so maybe that's part of it.

    Plus it's more traditional. Obstruction of justice featured in both the Nixon and Clinton articles of impeachment. A lot of Iran-Contra conspirators were also charged with obstruction, either of justice or of Congress. Obstruction is the little black dress of executive branch malfeasance. It goes with anything. Obstruction is what people mean when they say "it's not the crime, it's the cover-up".
  • EutychusEutychus Shipmate
    Martin54 wrote: »
    Eutychus wrote: »
    If his credibility is totally shot with the rest of the world this might prove problematic, at least as regards foreign policy, with a possible impact on the markets.
    How could that happen?
    Trump seems frequently to backtrack on his announcements.

    If I was a world leader meeting with Trump I would go into any discussion with him with the assumption that I could take anything he said with a pinch of salt. If there is not an atmosphere of mutual confidence, some belief that both sides will hold up their end of a deal, there will be no deal. That would in turn lead to more cautious, defensive positions, with an impact on profitability, and more uncertainty, which markets don't like.
  • mr cheesymr cheesy Shipmate
    What this situation clearly needs is Michael J Fox. He tried to stitch up poor Tom Kirkman - trying to make out he was incapacitated due to his recent sad bereavement - he'd surely have a field-day with Mr Trump.

    OTOH, if Designated Survivor is to be believed, the investigation into incapacity would require the majority of the cabinet and vice president would have to push for it.
  • Golden KeyGolden Key Shipmate, Glory
    Well, well, well. Figured as much when it happened, back in 2015.

    "Exclusive: Bornstein claims Trump dictated the glowing health letter" (CNN).

    Oy vey.
  • BoogieBoogie Heaven Host
    Golden Key wrote: »
    Well, well, well. Figured as much when it happened, back in 2015.

    "Exclusive: Bornstein claims Trump dictated the glowing health letter" (CNN).

    Oy vey.

    No surprise there at all. I remember saying at the time ‘Trump wrote that, it has his tone and style”

  • mr cheesymr cheesy Shipmate
    I believe Mr Trump is going to be undone by his own ego.
  • Golden KeyGolden Key Shipmate, Glory
    Personally, if I were a doc and someone raided my office the way T's minions did Bornstein's, I'd be inclined to call the cops. But it sounds like he was as much of a wreck as his office. And maybe he was worried what else the minions might do.
  • BoogieBoogie Heaven Host
    mr cheesy wrote: »
    I believe Mr Trump is going to be undone by his own ego.

    You’d think that would have happened long ago if there were any morals left in the world :disappointed:

  • EutychusEutychus Shipmate
    mr cheesy wrote: »
    if Designated Survivor is to be believed, the investigation into incapacity would require the majority of the cabinet and vice president would have to push for it.
    Designated Survivor appears to be joining House of Cards and Homeland as having more plausible plot lines than the actual presidency.

  • Golden KeyGolden Key Shipmate, Glory
    Heck, Scandal has a more plausible plot than this presidency! And Scandal is basically like taking all the people messes in the OT, and smooshing them together.
  • Golden Key wrote: »
    But it sounds like he was as much of a wreck as his office.

    Certainly not a doctor I'd put any trust in. But what should we expect in a world in which drug companies, through their TV commercials, encourage patients to tell doctors what treatment is right for them, rather than the other way around.
  • Barnabas62Barnabas62 Shipmate, Host Emeritus
    Kiefer Sutherland for 2020? Unfortunately he's British Canadian (according to Wikipedia). Plus a chequered past. But a mesmeric actor.

    Designated Survivor is very good; a must-see watch for me.

    Trump has become a must-avoid watch or listen. Makes me want to throw things
  • Gramps49Gramps49 Shipmate
    Ty Cobbs, one of the lawyers for Trump, has now resigned. The Clinton Impeachment Emmet Flood, is now in. Sounds ominous.
  • BoogieBoogie Heaven Host
    Is this a joke?

    “House Republicans nominate Trump for Nobel peace prize.”

    Am I seeing a totally different man from them?

  • ClimacusClimacus Shipmate
    Well Obama got one (far too early in my view), so no doubt Trump's fanbois think he should have one too as he is huuuuuuger than that Obama pretender.

    These people really are on a different planet. I can't thank you Boogie, sorry, because I think I'm worse off for knowing this.
  • Jane RJane R Shipmate
    Oh, I dunno. Credit where credit is due: North and South Korea have agreed that the Korean War is (finally) over, obviously because they need to unite against a common enemy. In the unlikely event that Trump does get the Nobel Peace Prize, think of it as a backhanded compliment...
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