That would certainly get a reaction at my church, where the opening words tend to be something like, "It's just about 10:30, so let's make a start". I'm tempted to see if I can get one of the leaders to try it...
That would certainly get a reaction at my church, where the opening words tend to be something like, "It's just about 10:30, so let's make a start". I'm tempted to see if I can get one of the leaders to try it...
In this part of the world *Arise! In silence let us be attentive!* could be rendered in the vernacular as *Get off yer arses! Shurrup, and listen!*, but I wouldn't recommend it...
That would certainly get a reaction at my church, where the opening words tend to be something like, "It's just about 10:30, so let's make a start". I'm tempted to see if I can get one of the leaders to try it...
My first Sunday at a country parish (which turned out to be a most lovely Placement) there was hardly anyone there at supposed start time, 08:30. By 08:40 the place was heaving (come to see what the new minister was like). I opened, after greeting them, "I hoped that you'd be here by half past eight". To which one wag replied from the back, "Why, what happened at half eight?"
At least you weren't gauging the start time of the service (as I experienced in West Africa) by the height of the sun in the sky.
As a student in Glasgow many moons ago, I sometimes attended St George's Tron church. The morning service would begin with the choir singing a short introit; the first spoken words, by the Minister, were, "Let us continue in worship ...".
I have the privilege of acting as liturgical deacon, i.e, leading worship for the first part of the service at one of the churches in our team this coming Sunday. I am expected to welcome the congregation, so I will probably say something like "Welcome to our service of Holy Communion here at St M...'s (name of village). Then refer people to the hymn book and to printed order of service, before announcing the first hymn
(I've been told that I must not say "Hello boys and girls. We are going to kick off with hymn 123etc) 😁
As a student in Glasgow many moons ago, I sometimes attended St George's Tron church. The morning service would begin with the choir singing a short introit; the first spoken words, by the Minister, were, "Let us continue in worship ...".
I would rather that than (as I often hear) the service beginning with a rousing humn sung with gusto, and then “Our worship begins on page 4”.
In another life I was a ‘worship leader’ and I know only too well how annoying it is when singing is regarded as ‘worship’ and the rest of the service is not. But the reverse is also true. Whatever we just sung was worship, just as much as what we are about to say.
Agree absolutely.
I wonder what God thinks of our failings in worship?
We had a bit of a hiccup last Sunday. After saying Good Evening and welcome…. Our priest invited us to sit down as there were rather a lot of notices, including her forthcoming retirement. The Introit should have followed. I’m not sure whether it was the fault of the stand-in organist or the choir director ( discombobulated by the news?) or the priest, but after a very long pause, the priest announced the first hymn, and then we had the introit. Later there was another delay starting the anthem, but it had been announced. I think the organist was just not ready for it at that point.
<snip>
I am expected to welcome the congregation, so I will probably say something like "Welcome to our service of Holy Communion here at St M...'s (name of village). Then refer people to the hymn book and to printed order of service, before announcing the first hymn
That's fine, but shouldn't it all come after you've said *In the name of the Father etc.*, and/or *The Lord be with you*? Otherwise, the formal opening words become redundant.
Agree absolutely.
I wonder what God thinks of our failings in worship?
We had a bit of a hiccup last Sunday. After saying Good Evening and welcome…. Our priest invited us to sit down as there were rather a lot of notices, including her forthcoming retirement. The Introit should have followed. I’m not sure whether it was the fault of the stand-in organist or the choir director ( discombobulated by the news?) or the priest, but after a very long pause, the priest announced the first hymn, and then we had the introit. Later there was another delay starting the anthem, but it had been announced. I think the organist was just not ready for it at that point.
O well - even in Quires and Places Where They Sing things don't always go according to plan...
<snip>
I am expected to welcome the congregation, so I will probably say something like "Welcome to our service of Holy Communion here at St M...'s (name of village). Then refer people to the hymn book and to printed order of service, before announcing the first hymn
That's fine, but shouldn't it all come after you've said *In the name of the Father etc.*, and/or *The Lord be with you*? Otherwise, the formal opening words become redundant.
I’d say it may be the other way around—the welcome and announcements before the first hymn and “In the name of . . . ,” put the welcome and announcements before/outside the liturgy proper, with the hymn and liturgical greeting marking the start of the liturgy.
Well, there probably isn't a *right* way, but my tidy and minimalist mind prefers the liturgical greeting to be the first words, any opening hymn being either unannounced (save by a Bell), or given out by a cantor before the greeting...
Well, there probably isn't a *right* way, but my tidy and minimalist mind prefers the liturgical greeting to be the first words, any opening hymn being either unannounced (save by a Bell), or given out by a cantor before the greeting...
We have a disembodied voice from the sacristy over the PA announcing the hymn.
It used to be the bell and the musical intro to the first hymn. But now we have a three homily priest. The first after the greeting introduces the theme at length, the second is that actual homily after the gospel, and the third comes in the form of a paragraph of wise words at the dismissal. Unfortunately he has a particularly impenitrable Indian accent, and he doesn't have a gift for preaching.
Bishops Finger, there is a more formal greeting included in the service
That's fine, but shouldn't it all come after you've said *In the name of the Father etc.*, and/or *The Lord be with you*? Otherwise, the formal opening words become redundant.
The formal greeting is this followed by the hymn:
Welcome in the name of Christ. God's grace, mercy and peace be with you, and also with you.
As God’s people, we have gathered. Let us worship him together.
Our Team Parish uses a variant on Common Worship which keeps everyone who officiates on their toes.
1. Before the opening hymn/greeting
2. Before the first reading
3. Before the second reading
4. After the Gospel reading
5. During the notices etc. etc. before the final blessing
Debate: Is the welcome to worship part of Worship?
I can see both views being expressed in practices here. Those like @Closet Druid who have the "In the name of the Father..." and those such as @Nick Tamen where there is often a clear break, often including a silence, before worship proper is started.
Debate: Is the welcome to worship part of Worship?
Interesting question. Years ago I was at a conference where each meeting started on the dot of the appointed time with the worship band simply starting to play and worship. Everyone soon got the idea and stopped arriving two minutes late and then expecting some time to settle and chat.
I was reminded of this only this morning at our service, where the musicians were playing a song and the formal "start" of the service was about 7 minutes delayed (no idea why). I wondered what it would take to make us (the congregation) take notice and engage. This didn't happen until after the welcoming words which are usually something along the lines of "Welcome, everyone, please find a seat."
The choir procession at our place is the signal to stop talking and stand up, ready for the service to begin, but to be fair, our normal congregation is always ready to “engage”.
Debate: Is the welcome to worship part of Worship?
I can see both views being expressed in practices here. Those like @Closet Druid who have the "In the name of the Father..." and those such as @Nick Tamen where there is often a clear break, often including a silence, before worship proper is started.
We have a welcome, then a pause, then a call to worship or short response, then the first hymn.
Debate: Is the welcome to worship part of Worship?
I can see both views being expressed in practices here. Those like @Closet Druid who have the "In the name of the Father..." and those such as @Nick Tamen where there is often a clear break, often including a silence, before worship proper is started.
We have a welcome, then a pause, then a call to worship or short response, then the first hymn.
As I noted upthread (before the recent bump), at our place it’s:
• the greeting
• welcome and announcements (hopefully brief)
• a short (again hopefully) prelude—instrumental or vocal/choral
• the call to worship (responsive)
• the first hymn
Comments
In this part of the world *Arise! In silence let us be attentive!* could be rendered in the vernacular as *Get off yer arses! Shurrup, and listen!*, but I wouldn't recommend it...
My first Sunday at a country parish (which turned out to be a most lovely Placement) there was hardly anyone there at supposed start time, 08:30. By 08:40 the place was heaving (come to see what the new minister was like). I opened, after greeting them, "I hoped that you'd be here by half past eight". To which one wag replied from the back, "Why, what happened at half eight?"
As a student in Glasgow many moons ago, I sometimes attended St George's Tron church. The morning service would begin with the choir singing a short introit; the first spoken words, by the Minister, were, "Let us continue in worship ...".
(I've been told that I must not say "Hello boys and girls. We are going to kick off with hymn 123etc) 😁
I would rather that than (as I often hear) the service beginning with a rousing humn sung with gusto, and then “Our worship begins on page 4”.
In another life I was a ‘worship leader’ and I know only too well how annoying it is when singing is regarded as ‘worship’ and the rest of the service is not. But the reverse is also true. Whatever we just sung was worship, just as much as what we are about to say.
I wonder what God thinks of our failings in worship?
We had a bit of a hiccup last Sunday. After saying Good Evening and welcome…. Our priest invited us to sit down as there were rather a lot of notices, including her forthcoming retirement. The Introit should have followed. I’m not sure whether it was the fault of the stand-in organist or the choir director ( discombobulated by the news?) or the priest, but after a very long pause, the priest announced the first hymn, and then we had the introit. Later there was another delay starting the anthem, but it had been announced. I think the organist was just not ready for it at that point.
That's fine, but shouldn't it all come after you've said *In the name of the Father etc.*, and/or *The Lord be with you*? Otherwise, the formal opening words become redundant.
O well - even in Quires and Places Where They Sing things don't always go according to plan...
We have a disembodied voice from the sacristy over the PA announcing the hymn.
It used to be the bell and the musical intro to the first hymn. But now we have a three homily priest. The first after the greeting introduces the theme at length, the second is that actual homily after the gospel, and the third comes in the form of a paragraph of wise words at the dismissal. Unfortunately he has a particularly impenitrable Indian accent, and he doesn't have a gift for preaching.
That's fine, but shouldn't it all come after you've said *In the name of the Father etc.*, and/or *The Lord be with you*? Otherwise, the formal opening words become redundant.
The formal greeting is this followed by the hymn:
Welcome in the name of Christ. God's grace, mercy and peace be with you,
and also with you.
As God’s people, we have gathered.
Let us worship him together.
Our Team Parish uses a variant on Common Worship which keeps everyone who officiates on their toes.
Yes, Common Worship allows for a lot of variations, so each church can use what suits their circumstances best.
@Alan29
Our chap is a five-homily man, to wit:
1. Before the opening hymn/greeting
2. Before the first reading
3. Before the second reading
4. After the Gospel reading
5. During the notices etc. etc. before the final blessing
I can see both views being expressed in practices here. Those like @Closet Druid who have the "In the name of the Father..." and those such as @Nick Tamen where there is often a clear break, often including a silence, before worship proper is started.
I was reminded of this only this morning at our service, where the musicians were playing a song and the formal "start" of the service was about 7 minutes delayed (no idea why). I wondered what it would take to make us (the congregation) take notice and engage. This didn't happen until after the welcoming words which are usually something along the lines of "Welcome, everyone, please find a seat."
We have a welcome, then a pause, then a call to worship or short response, then the first hymn.
• the greeting
• welcome and announcements (hopefully brief)
• a short (again hopefully) prelude—instrumental or vocal/choral
• the call to worship (responsive)
• the first hymn