Church heating systems

FishWithABicycleFishWithABicycle Shipmate Posts: 1
Our church heating system has been condemned as irreparable and needs complete replacement. As members of the PCC we are having great difficulty identifying the best way to replace it. Main issues being that there are an awful lot of high-pressure sales people trying to flog their particular heating solution that isn't particularly suitable for a church, but the sales people have a shakey grasp of the physics and are far too focused on earning their commission rather than finding the right solution; and secondly that most modern heating systems are focused on keeping a building at a comfortable temperature all week long, whereas we only need the building to be at a comfortable temperature for 10 hours a week. Also there is no chance of adding any insulation to the thick stone walls.

There's so many different techniques and technologies to choose from all of which have salespeople insisting theirs is the best, but who to believe? If your church has had to install new heating in the last 5 years (tales of an 80 year old system that is still going strong are sadly irrelevant) then it would be good to know what your church chose and how well it has worked for you.

Comments

  • BroJamesBroJames Purgatory Host
    The Church of England’s push to net zero means that you need a faculty nowadays to replace heating sources. It’s worth getting in touch very early on with your DAC (Diocesan Advisory Committee). They may well have an independent advisor who can help you explore the options, and if you have to go for a fossil fuel option will enable you to show you’ve properly explored the possibilities.

    There’s some useful stuff here
  • Some years ago, Our Place (huge Edwardian barn) had to replace the church heating boilers - two gas-guzzling monsters - but was able to retain the existing pipework and radiators. The new (and much smaller) single boiler was supposed to be more efficient, but there was no noticeable increase in warmth, and every week brings fresh appeals from the priest-in-charge for more £££ to meet ever-increasing utility bills.

    If your church is only open for services for a few hours per week, might it be possible to hold some, at least, in a more easily-heated space, such as the vestry? We could do that, if the will to do something a bit different were present.

    As @BroJames says, best get in touch asap with your DAC. You are wise to be wary of false prophets, who really only want fat profits...
  • What climate are you in?
  • BroJamesBroJames Purgatory Host
    If I’m right, PCC suggests Church of England - so UK temperate.
  • I can testify to the difficulty of this one! Our 1880 church has been through coal, oil and gas systems, all using hot water radiators. It might be worth getting an architect to advise you before letting a heating contractor loose on it.

    The first thing, which you have probably already done, is to write a statement of requirement, laying out what parts of the building need to be heated and when. Heating companies don't always seem to understand that running a system at full power for a few hours and then leaving it cold for most of a week puts a lot of thermal stress on the equipment, shortening its life.

    Do you currently have hot water radiators, or ducted hot air? If you can go to hot air you will be able to heat the building quickly and have the possibility of integrating a dehumidifier, usually helpful in an old stone building (within limits - old wood doesn't need to be too dry). High efficiency systems have obvious advantages, but the additional capital cost may be greater than the running cost over its life. If ducted hot air is an option, repairs are usually limited to the heat source and controls. Do you have ceiling fans in the sanctuary? This is a relatively low cost way to improve efficiency by circulating the air in both winter and summer and is often suitable for older buildings.
  • Gramps49Gramps49 Shipmate
    Deleted
  • ... we only need the building to be at a comfortable temperature for 10 hours a week ...

    Welcome to your first post, FWAB! Have you considered using the church for more hours per week? A day nursery, play groups, drop-in centre for senior citizens? Of course, those would throw up their own problems of a kitchen and toilets and disabled access. But the income from extra activities and probable grants would defray the cost of a new heating system. Plus be missional in their own right.

  • ArethosemyfeetArethosemyfeet Shipmate, Heaven Host
    We had new heating installed 3 years ago, replacing our infra-red heaters with 4 9kW fan heaters (we're off the gas grid so it's electric or bust) and installing 2 destratification fans to try and stop warm air accumulating near the roof. They're very effective but they are expensive to run (to maintain a target daytime temp of 10°C, which helps prevent the damp and mould that plague us creeping in, rising to 18°C for the Sunday service, uses around 50MWh annually) and we've had to cut back to setting a 5°C target outside of services. Draught proofing is as big a deal as insulation, and one of our major sources of heat loss. We were advised (several different sources) that a dehumidifier was unlikely to be effective, particularly if the temperature was not raised.

    The installer we went with (AFS electrical in Glasgow) are reasonably knowledgeable about churches, and were willing to travel out to us in the Hebrides for the install.

    Happy to answers any questions if I can.
  • JLBJLB Shipmate
    We haven't yet got to this point but have had an energy audit paid for by our diocese. The current thinking seems to be heating the people rather than the building, with infra-red heaters where you haven't got pews, or under pew electric heating, either of which can be switched on shortly before they are needed. But ask your diocese, who should be able to offer help.
  • One thing I intensely dislike is suspended radiant electric heaters which make one's head too hot but leave your feet cold.
  • PomonaPomona Shipmate
    One thing I intensely dislike is suspended radiant electric heaters which make one's head too hot but leave your feet cold.

    Ditto - they are very uncomfortable if you are sat underneath!
  • BroJamesBroJames Purgatory Host
    I find overhead infra red heaters very uncomfortable. Being tall makes the hot head/ cold feet effect more unpleasant.
  • Bishops FingerBishops Finger Shipmate
    edited August 8
    The Tin Tabernacle Of My Youth had overhead infra-red heaters, and yes, they were uncomfortable to sit beneath!

    The church had a low roof, though, so they warmed up the interior fairly well. It's a long time ago now (the building was demolished in 2004). I remember them being installed, but I can't recall what sort of system they replaced...
  • Jengie JonJengie Jon Shipmate
    I think you really do need to consider what you want to do. There are more options than you might think and talking to specialist church heating providers (yes they do exist) may well help.

    Mr Google turned up this article and this guidance which seems to behave some authority looks handy.

    From a practical perspective if there is anyway to offset heating costs by increasing use of the building I would go for it but that is me who does not believe church building are there to be closed.
  • JLBJLB Shipmate
    Older infra-red heaters were very uncomfortable, but the technology has improved hugely in the last few years. Churches in our diocese who have got the new ones have been very pleased with them.
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