Bicycling and racism

GwaiGwai Epiphanies Host
Biking, at least in countries with poor biking support like mine may be one of the only times has to deal with being a minority. Some of the similarities between microaggressions one gets seem relevant:
  • The infrastructure is made for others and makes bikers less safe
  • Conversations about jerk car drivers often turn into "but bikers are jerks too"
  • Any obnoxious biker is taken as proof of both-sideism
  • Aggressive and unsafe behaviors are sometimes a predictable coping mechanism for bikers
  • In an accident people will tend to side with the driver
  • Biking is much more dangerous than driving


Of course for those of us who are white and otherwise privileged, we can always just get off the bike while People of Color can't so easily avoid racism.

Comments

  • KarlLBKarlLB Shipmate
    Gwai wrote: »
    Biking, at least in countries with poor biking support like mine may be one of the only times has to deal with being a minority. Some of the similarities between microaggressions one gets seem relevant:
    • The infrastructure is made for others and makes bikers less safe
    • Conversations about jerk car drivers often turn into "but bikers are jerks too"
    • Any obnoxious biker is taken as proof of both-sideism
    • Aggressive and unsafe behaviors are sometimes a predictable coping mechanism for bikers
    • In an accident people will tend to side with the driver
    • Biking is much more dangerous than driving


    Of course for those of us who are white and otherwise privileged, we can always just get off the bike while People of Color can't so easily avoid racism.

    Yep. That just about sums it up. Outgrouping, projecting perceived faults of members of the group as a feature of the group, and so on.
  • Not sure I would agree in a crash, people tend to side with the driver. At least around here the pedestrian, then the bicyclist seem to be more in favor than the driver.
  • KarlLBKarlLB Shipmate
    Gramps49 wrote: »
    Not sure I would agree in a crash, people tend to side with the driver. At least around here the pedestrian, then the bicyclist seem to be more in favor than the driver.

    We've recently had a couple of stories in the cycling press recently of drivers endangering young children by driving fast and close to them while they're cycling to school. In one case it was on a school street - a road where motor traffic is limited at school start and finish times for this very purpose.

    Comments on the video on social media - condemnation of parents for letting children ride bikes to school and defence of the driver: "he didn't actually hit them did he?", "just a bloke trying to do his job" etc etc.

    It may be a minority, but its a loud, vociferous and aggressive one. Like with other -isms.
  • I am usually a pedestrian. I have had startling encounters with cyclists who lacked manners, rode on the wrong side of the street or went too fast for safety. Legally, they should be in the street, but they ride on the sidewalk because the drivers pose a great danger to them. A possible but unlikely solution might be to discourage the use of automobiles.

    I have never encountered a unicyclist causing trouble.
  • RuthRuth Shipmate
    KarlLB wrote: »
    It may be a minority, but its a loud, vociferous and aggressive one. Like with other -isms.

    If this is a minority view, then the tendency is in fact not to side with the driver.

    I don't see the point of the comparison between a prejudice against cyclists and systemic racism.
  • GwaiGwai Epiphanies Host
    One point would be to show white bicyclists how frustrating it can be to be a racial minority.
  • I doubt it. Here in this city we seem to have 2 distinct subtypes: the ethnically diverse deliverers of fast food ( nearly all Asian but increasingly Latino) and the MAMIL ( middle aged man in Lycra) with female counterpart who are overwhelmingly white and middle/ professional class and who tend to ride in packs. This may afford a degree of protection in a town with very limited bike tracks and very aggressive drivers.

    In fact I think the food delivery guys may be cut a bit more slack as they are perceived to be doing a tough job for little money, and the MAMILs are perceived to be entitled wankers ( especially when they congregate at the local caff for their skinny soy decaf lattes ( aka the Why bother?) & leave their velocipedes all over the footpath.
  • KarlLBKarlLB Shipmate
    edited October 2023
    Oh God here we go again.
  • Would you care to unpack that?
  • KarlLBKarlLB Shipmate
    edited October 2023
    Sojourner wrote: »
    Would you care to unpack that?

    Well, every time cycling gets mentioned, someone will read a litany of offences attributed to cyclists, and this is deemed reason to dislike "cyclists" as a group. It happens across social media, it happens down the pub, it happens everywhere.

    Which rather proves Gwai's point. Frankly I'm weary of it, having to defend one of my means of transport because someone saw someone else on a bike go through a red light. The attributes of some are spoken of as if they apply to all.
  • My son works for Portland (OR, USA) Metro. While he has moved on to grant writing for the organization, his initial job was to develop new bike friendly approaches in Portland. Here are some things they have done to make it safer for bikes and pedestrians.
  • KarlLB wrote: »
    Sojourner wrote: »
    Would you care to unpack that?

    Well, every time cycling gets mentioned, someone will read a litany of offences attributed to cyclists, and this is deemed reason to dislike "cyclists" as a group. It happens across social media, it happens down the pub, it happens everywhere.

    Which rather proves Gwai's point. Frankly I'm weary of it, having to defend one of my means of transport because someone saw someone else on a bike go through a red light. The attributes of some are spoken of as if they apply to all.
    .

    Oh come on Karl, re read my post.

    Gwai did not make a point but suggested that racism might play a part in discrimination against cyclists. I don’t knowwhere in the US Gwai might live, and what the demographic of the local cyclists might be. Howeveras an elderly professional white pedestrianwoman in my patch I sure as hell know who is disliked ( ?discriminated against) bt motorist & pedestrian alike and it sure as well is not the multiracial couriers.

  • Hell not well
  • RuthRuth Shipmate
    KarlLB wrote: »
    Well, every time cycling gets mentioned, someone will read a litany of offences attributed to cyclists, and this is deemed reason to dislike "cyclists" as a group.

    Except that's not what happened. Sojourner wrote about two groups of cyclists, and the one characterized negatively is a fairly particular group disliked because of social class perceptions.
  • GwaiGwai Epiphanies Host
    In my neighborhood there are lots of middle class white bikers. My husband is one. (I bike too but he goes out much more.) But there's still a car versus bike dynamic with drivers generally siding with drivers and bicyclists with bicyclists. And there are more drivers by far, so most people think of cars, support cars, and accept bikes to be cars. If bikers do not act like cars, they are blamed.
  • “Behave like cars” ( or their drivers ). I can see why blame could be apportioned for bike riders running red lights, not observing stop signs, not using lights after dark i.e. for not onserving the rules of the road. But otherwise?
  • And further: what about ethnically diverse riders in your neighbourhood? Do they exist and are they doing deliveries rather than getting from A to B?

    I’m genuinely curious.
  • GwaiGwai Epiphanies Host
    edited October 2023
    Re getting yelled at for not behaving like a car/car driver, to be fair I've been yelled at for doing car-like things and non carlike things. I've been yelled at for: taking the lane (utterly legal where I am and known to be safer here), riding on the side of the road (not taking the lane), turning when it was my turn, and going straight when it was my turn*. A little while ago my husband (@Bullfrog) had someone yell "You're not a car" when he was turning left on a two lane road, taking the lane.

    Note that I live in one of the few actually diverse neighborhoods in the city. Generally I see a significant number of Black or Latino guys cycling, almost always on the sidewalk. (Slowly, these are not the jerks who almost run you over generally.) Biking is definitely a racial justice issue here in that tons white bikers almost never get tickets and almost all the biking tickets are given out in neighborhoods where most people are Black .
    This article Biking While Black is very worth reading both about the open police bias and why.
    Barajas' study focuses exclusively on tickets for cycling on sidewalks which, in 2019, made up 90 percent of bicycle-related citations in Chicago. As one might guess, 93 percent of these were issued on streets that had no bikeways. The vast majority of these citations were in predominantly Black neighborhoods
    Also generally bike lanes and other things that make biking safer are to be found in whiter neighborhoods.
    While I prefer the previous article I like the quotes in this article too.
    "In my area, we have absolutely no bike lanes," said Deloris Lucas, 61, of the Riverdale neighborhood on the Far South Side. She represents the South Side on the Mayor's Bicycle Advisory Council, which meets quarterly to discuss a range of bicycle issues. "You take a risk riding anywhere."
    which is from another article by a bigger paper



    *That guy threatened to run me off the road and looked like he was considering making good on his threat.
  • Sojourner wrote: »
    And further: what about ethnically diverse riders in your neighbourhood? Do they exist and are they doing deliveries rather than getting from A to B?

    I’m genuinely curious.

    I'm not an amateur demographer, but I've noticed folks of all kinds on bikes. I'm not sure people who bike as delivery guys are distinct to me as opposed to commuters or recreational riders, but it's a thing.

    Our neighborhood is also intensely diverse, and pretty bicycle-friendly by Chicago standards, so that shouldn't be surprising.

    The only time I've ever heard of anyone getting ticked for riding on the sidewalk, it was a black guy and a lot of folks felt that was profiling, since it's a law that is broken pretty often, usually to no injury.
  • Between the 2 of you, you’ve made a case.

    Your being in a diverse neighbourhood in Chicago explains quite a bit.

    I guess like here, the more suburban it becomes the fewer bikes.
  • RuthRuth Shipmate
    In a car-centric environment, if you're transporting yourself around in any other way, you're being discriminated against. The built environment is largely working against you. Given that driving is far more expensive than walking, cycling, or taking public transit, that discrimination falls more on people with less money, who are disproportionately BIPOC.

    But I'm not really getting the comparison of cycling itself to systemic racism. Maybe it's because I've spent a lot more of my non-car transportation time walking rather than cycling and 60% of the traffic deaths in my city last year were pedestrians. Maybe it's because there are so few commuting cyclists where I live -- a heck of a lot more people get to work here on foot or mass transit than by bicycle, and cycling is by and large a leisure activity for people of all racial and ethnic backgrounds. Maybe it's because the most avid cyclist I ever knew was a Black guy who rode an expensive bike entirely for fun and got pulled over by cops for driving while Black but not cycling while Black - I guess a Lycra outfit screams privilege in a way a Toyota 4-door sedan does not.

    In other words, I think you have to have a particular experience of cycling for the comparison to systemic racism to have any resonance.
  • MaryLouiseMaryLouise Shipmate, Host Emeritus
    edited October 2023
    In South Africa, we have a number of fairly arduous cycle marathons over mountain passes and along scenic coastal roads, attended by cyclists from international locations as well as around southern Africa, the majority being young able-bodied middle-class men. Extreme sports are well-attended: cycling, running (the notorious Kalahari Augrabies marathon crosses the Kalahari desert for 250km), rock-climbing, canoeing, diving or surfing. Very macho, most participants fitness fanatics with back-up support teams of mostly women partners, coaches, paramedics, nutritionists.

    Because of the high-profile nature of these sporting events, the cyclists (some of them tourists) need to practise through the year and that is when they experience themselves as unusually vulnerable and unwelcome on off-road rides through mountain valleys, vineyards and small towns. There is limited mobile phone reception and competition for right of way along dirt roads or paths used by fruit harvesting trailers, farm vehicles (tractors) and 4x4 vehicles driven by young farmers, along with mountain bikes and motorbikers in groups. Not a good mix and some nasty accidents because most cyclists and drivers are used to getting their own way on the roads. The farm labourers driving tractors or trailers think of these rural roads as their territory and want interlopers in lycra out, will not yield or reverse on narrow roads because they are working and the visitors are just having fun. No traffic police and few ambulance services, almost no road signs and gates left open so livestock wander out and block lanes. Privileged leisure activities that can turn into blood sports.
  • Yep it cuts both ways
  • A Feminine ForceA Feminine Force Shipmate
    edited October 2023
    Does anyone here subscribe to this Youtube channel?

    He's from London, Ontario - my hometown - now living in Amsterdam.

    Having bicycled in both cities (and many elsewheres including now where I live on the Costa since I don't own a car) - I feel like the man has a lot of sane observations and recommendations re: urban planning for less car-centric ways of getting from A to B.

    https://www.youtube.com/@NotJustBikes

    AFF
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