This picture has arrived on my FB page as part of an advert for all-inclusive rail holidays to Italy. But what is it, and does it actually exist? If it's a diesel, it ought to be ashamed of itself - but it looks more like a steam-electric loco (oil-fired as no tender). Any ideas?
This picture has arrived on my FB page as part of an advert for all-inclusive rail holidays to Italy. But what is it, and does it actually exist? If it's a diesel, it ought to be ashamed of itself - but it looks more like a steam-electric loco (oil-fired as no tender). Any ideas?
Apologies, but for me the link says 'URL signature expired'. Has it prematurely hit the buffers?
Same here, but be assured that it was a fake...
As to the comfort or otherwise of modern trains, the blue HS1 units we have here (known in Southern Railway fashion as 6-JAVs - they'd look splendid in malachite green) have rather austere interiors, BUT there is plenty of room for those of us with long knees. The seats are firm, though not uncomfortable, and certainly acceptable for the short run from here to London, anyway.
The most comfy trains I've been on in recent years are the SNCF's TGV units, where the first-class coaches are indeed first-class. Yes, they're not cheap, but it's worth paying extra for the comfort and convenience, especially if one can get an individual seat. My only complaint is that the things are so long (28 cars?), and my coach always seemed to be about half-a-mile from the buffer stops at the Gare Whatever...
Yes - I nearly broke my coccyx the first time I got onto one of the then-new Hitachi trains at Oxford station! I flopped down in a seat as I did on an HST or other train... and the cushion was about as thick and soft as a Rich Tea biscuit! Owww!!
Amazingly, and I have worked on speccing rolling stock, the new seats are ergonomically better for the adult human body over long distances and are likely to cause fewer issues for regular travellers than the Mk3 seats.
One of those cases where ‘I flopped down on it’ isn’t the real test - it was a flaw of previous rolling stock that you expected to!
When the new 800s came in there was a lot of comment about ironing board seats from people who didn’t get that what they liked about the old seats wasn’t great…
On another note I have actually broken my coccyx and I don’t recommend it!
Probably as well to note here that when commenting on the HSTs that they are a classic case of Caesar's dagger - three new blades and five new handles. In this case re-engining, suspension upgrades, and I have no idea how many interiors. I remember being thrown around on a hard seat in an early one when it was new in the late 70s.
Our local trains (South Eastern) seem mostly OK as regards seats, except for the lack of legroom in all but the HS1 trains, as mentioned earlier.
The units which work Thameslink services (700 class IIRC) have, however, very hard seats, or so it seems to this rawboned individual. They may be good for my skeleton, but the hour-long journey to Denmark Hill (for King's College Hospital) wasn't good for my bum...albeit still preferable to tottering around Bromley South station changing platforms and trains...
KCH signed me off (as either cured or hopeless) some years ago, so I no longer need to make the journey.
The most comfortable trains I can recall from many years back were the Southern's 2BIL electric units, or the contemporary steam-hauled (and steam-heated) Maunsell carriages. We had the latter working into The Town Of My Youth until 1965!
The units which work Thameslink services (700 class IIRC) have, however, very hard seats, or so it seems to this rawboned individual.
I think these were the ones which the Press said had "ironing board seats".
Interesting that, following that, Greater Anglia modified their seat order for their new trains. Having moved from Ipswich in 2017, I haven't been on them. In the old GA Mk3s, I found the standard class seats more comfortable than those in first class - the latter had a bulge in the stuffing in just the wrong place!
I'm not too keen on the seats on the refurbished GW HST's, especially the high backs. I think that a few are still trundling around Devon and Cornwall (Scotrail have some HSTs too).
Maunsells in 1965 - amazing! I never travelled on a 2-BIL, sadly. The only Southern Railway trains I've been on (except in preservation) are Bullied 4-SUBs, 4-CORs and the Waterloo & City stock.
The units which work Thameslink services (700 class IIRC) have, however, very hard seats, or so it seems to this rawboned individual.
I think these were the ones which the Press said had "ironing board seats".
Interesting that, following that, Greater Anglia modified their seat order for their new trains. Having moved from Ipswich in 2017, I haven't been on them. In the old GA Mk3s, I found the standard class seats more comfortable than those in first class - the latter had a bulge in the stuffing in just the wrong place!
I'm not too keen on the seats on the refurbished GW HST's, especially the high backs. I think that a few are still trundling around Devon and Cornwall (Scotrail have some HSTs too).
Maunsells in 1965 - amazing! I never travelled on a 2-BIL, sadly. The only Southern Railway trains I've been on (except in preservation) are Bullied 4-SUBs, 4-CORs and the Waterloo & City stock.
Maunsell coaches were still in use on the old South Eastern main line east of Redhill, until replaced by the ghastly Tadpole DMUs, and also on the former Brighton lines south of Tunbridge Wells West. True, they were a little past their sell-by date, but still very comfy!
The 4CORs were also a Maunsell/Lynes design, but their riding at speed (especially the motor cars) was said to be rather lively. Bulleid's 4SUBs were austere, but very rugged and reliable, as were his 2HAL sets, and yet his mainline coaches were second to none as regards comfort.
Happily, examples of Bulleid and Maunsell coaches can be seen on various heritage lines, as a welcome change from the ubiquitous BR Mark 1s!
Yes, I always seek out pre-BR coaches if I can - eg Bulleids and Maunsells on the Bluebell. The other week we rode in a somewhat faded Hawksworth inspection saloon on the Pontypool & Blaenavon - with sofas!
BTW this had appeared on "Rail Advent": More seats on Anglia train services this Summer. What they mean, of course, is more carriages - more seats would simplp block the gangways.
The Gresley buffets were indeed probably the last pre-BR coaches to remain in revenue service - and didn't they look awful in blue and grey!
After the end of steam on the Southern in 1967, some Bulleid coaches were transferred to Scotland, where they were painted maroon. I'm not sure if any were in revenue service, but some, at least, lasted until the 70s in departmental use.
Some Bulleid vehicles were transferred to the Eastern, Western, and Scottish regions, around 1965-1967, thus giving the benighted travellers in those outlying parts a taste (albeit late in the day) of Proper Coaches™.
They were all used in revenue service, the last few remaining in traffic in Scotland until 1970.
I asked Auntie Google exactly that question, and she answered: 1977, which I found astonishing. I had no recollection of wooden body carriages in service then, though I must have seen them all the time.
I asked Auntie Google exactly that question, and she answered: 1977, which I found astonishing. I had no recollection of wooden body carriages in service then, though I must have seen them all the time.
Astonishing indeed, but, if true, a testament to the design and build quality.
I asked Auntie Google exactly that question, and she answered: 1977, which I found astonishing. I had no recollection of wooden body carriages in service then, though I must have seen them all the time.
Astonishing indeed, but, if true, a testament to the design and build quality.
I think there are rumours of 1978/9 swirling about (ie a year or two after the last ones were officially withdrawn).
The Thompson full brakes I think made it into the 1980s, as did the GWR siphons.
Oldest revenue earning *stock* now the Isle of Wight has ditched the 1938s has almost certainly got to be the LNER warwells and warflats that are (still) used to move tanks and armoured vehicles about?
A bit earlier actually: the Bloomers were designed by James McConnell. I understand, as Southern Division locos which were faster and more powerful than those on the Northern Division (?Precedents or Precursors - not the Whale kind) this caused a lot of resentment at Crewe. There is a long-running project to build a working replica but it seems to have stalled.
I'm pleased to see that a Hastings DEMU (sort of) is still up and running.
I remember My Old Dad taking me to Our Station to see (and hear ) them when they were first introduced...
The unit looks good in green - the blue and grey never suited them, although it could be argued that that egregious colour scheme never suited anything.
Other bits of Hastings units were used in 1965 to form the horrible blue *Tadpole* trains (class 206), which replaced our lovely Maunsell Moguls, Standard Class 4 264Ts, and green Maunsell coaches...
I didn't know the Tadpoles but I did know the similar Hampshire units. When I was at University they ran the Salisbury-Portsmouth and Alton services (until the latter closed). Even in 1971 they seemed obsolescent even though they were barely 10 years old.
Mind you, going down the hill from Medstead to Alton on the 45-foot rails was a sound to behold!
The longer-distance Cardiff-Portsmouth services were run by Hymeks (of blessed memory) and short rakes of carriages, except on Sunday when Swindon "Intercity" DMUs took over.
A Hastings unit was used on the Saturdays only Brighton-Exeter and return.
The former EMU coach was mostly used for mail traffic, with all doors locked, as there was no corridor connection between it and the former Hastings cars.
I'd have thought we'd only know such things from the US of A, or some Eastern European narrow-gauge forest railways? Really curious and slighly worried; does this part of the line need some urgent work or not, or is this a regular occurrence there, and no one's bothered and there's no issue?
It's worth noting, perhaps, that many of the heritage railways also keep their track and linesides in very good order - mostly, I guess, with volunteer labour.
What makes them look untidy sometimes is the amount of unrestored rolling stock sitting in sidings, though there seems to be an increasing use of plastic (?) sheeting to completely cover up coaches. Given the amount of time required to restore even one coach, this is a Good Idea, and improves the appearance of the yard...
Comments
Transport for Wales have some nice Mk 4 carriages on their mainline services, very comfortable even in Standard class.
Apologies, but for me the link says 'URL signature expired'. Has it prematurely hit the buffers?
Same here, but be assured that it was a fake...
As to the comfort or otherwise of modern trains, the blue HS1 units we have here (known in Southern Railway fashion as 6-JAVs - they'd look splendid in malachite green) have rather austere interiors, BUT there is plenty of room for those of us with long knees. The seats are firm, though not uncomfortable, and certainly acceptable for the short run from here to London, anyway.
The most comfy trains I've been on in recent years are the SNCF's TGV units, where the first-class coaches are indeed first-class. Yes, they're not cheap, but it's worth paying extra for the comfort and convenience, especially if one can get an individual seat. My only complaint is that the things are so long (28 cars?), and my coach always seemed to be about half-a-mile from the buffer stops at the Gare Whatever...
Amazingly, and I have worked on speccing rolling stock, the new seats are ergonomically better for the adult human body over long distances and are likely to cause fewer issues for regular travellers than the Mk3 seats.
One of those cases where ‘I flopped down on it’ isn’t the real test - it was a flaw of previous rolling stock that you expected to!
When the new 800s came in there was a lot of comment about ironing board seats from people who didn’t get that what they liked about the old seats wasn’t great…
On another note I have actually broken my coccyx and I don’t recommend it!
The units which work Thameslink services (700 class IIRC) have, however, very hard seats, or so it seems to this rawboned individual. They may be good for my skeleton, but the hour-long journey to Denmark Hill (for King's College Hospital) wasn't good for my bum...albeit still preferable to tottering around Bromley South station changing platforms and trains...
KCH signed me off (as either cured or hopeless) some years ago, so I no longer need to make the journey.
The most comfortable trains I can recall from many years back were the Southern's 2BIL electric units, or the contemporary steam-hauled (and steam-heated) Maunsell carriages. We had the latter working into The Town Of My Youth until 1965!
Interesting that, following that, Greater Anglia modified their seat order for their new trains. Having moved from Ipswich in 2017, I haven't been on them. In the old GA Mk3s, I found the standard class seats more comfortable than those in first class - the latter had a bulge in the stuffing in just the wrong place!
I'm not too keen on the seats on the refurbished GW HST's, especially the high backs. I think that a few are still trundling around Devon and Cornwall (Scotrail have some HSTs too).
Maunsells in 1965 - amazing! I never travelled on a 2-BIL, sadly. The only Southern Railway trains I've been on (except in preservation) are Bullied 4-SUBs, 4-CORs and the Waterloo & City stock.
Maunsell coaches were still in use on the old South Eastern main line east of Redhill, until replaced by the ghastly Tadpole DMUs, and also on the former Brighton lines south of Tunbridge Wells West. True, they were a little past their sell-by date, but still very comfy!
The 4CORs were also a Maunsell/Lynes design, but their riding at speed (especially the motor cars) was said to be rather lively. Bulleid's 4SUBs were austere, but very rugged and reliable, as were his 2HAL sets, and yet his mainline coaches were second to none as regards comfort.
Happily, examples of Bulleid and Maunsell coaches can be seen on various heritage lines, as a welcome change from the ubiquitous BR Mark 1s!
BTW this had appeared on "Rail Advent": More seats on Anglia train services this Summer. What they mean, of course, is more carriages - more seats would simplp block the gangways.
My money’s on the Gresley buffets.
I refreshed myself in a Thompson buffet on the West Highland Line in July 1978. (I also sailed on the "Maid of the Loch"!).
Well, they were the "Premier Line"!
After the end of steam on the Southern in 1967, some Bulleid coaches were transferred to Scotland, where they were painted maroon. I'm not sure if any were in revenue service, but some, at least, lasted until the 70s in departmental use.
Some Bulleid vehicles were transferred to the Eastern, Western, and Scottish regions, around 1965-1967, thus giving the benighted travellers in those outlying parts a taste (albeit late in the day) of Proper Coaches™.
They were all used in revenue service, the last few remaining in traffic in Scotland until 1970.
When was the last Gresley buffet car withdrawn?
Astonishing indeed, but, if true, a testament to the design and build quality.
I think there are rumours of 1978/9 swirling about (ie a year or two after the last ones were officially withdrawn).
The Thompson full brakes I think made it into the 1980s, as did the GWR siphons.
Oldest revenue earning *stock* now the Isle of Wight has ditched the 1938s has almost certainly got to be the LNER warwells and warflats that are (still) used to move tanks and armoured vehicles about?
And the Mk3s in service today are older than the Gresleys were then!
We know better: he is clearly a secret fan of BR 1960s electric and diesel traction.
*I think I have that right, it's certainly an LNWR design of the Webb era.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LNWR_Bloomer_Class
I daresay it won't be long before some enterprising manufacturer (Rapido Trains UK, I'm looking at you) produces a nice 00 scale model...
The third and fourth carriages in the set are clearly not "Hastings" shaped, does carriage 3 come from a BEP/CEP set?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AjWvixqk5lc
The buffet car comes from a BIG, and the next coach from a CEP. This article (by the owners) explains, and gives further details:
https://www.hastingsdiesels.co.uk/1001/
It's the sort of train the old Southern Railway would have cobbled together if necessary...
I'm pleased to see that a Hastings DEMU (sort of) is still up and running.
I remember My Old Dad taking me to Our Station to see (and hear
The unit looks good in green - the blue and grey never suited them, although it could be argued that that egregious colour scheme never suited anything.
Other bits of Hastings units were used in 1965 to form the horrible blue *Tadpole* trains (class 206), which replaced our lovely Maunsell Moguls, Standard Class 4 264Ts, and green Maunsell coaches...
Mind you, going down the hill from Medstead to Alton on the 45-foot rails was a sound to behold!
The longer-distance Cardiff-Portsmouth services were run by Hymeks (of blessed memory) and short rakes of carriages, except on Sunday when Swindon "Intercity" DMUs took over.
A Hastings unit was used on the Saturdays only Brighton-Exeter and return.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_Rail_Class_206#:~:text=The new units were given the numbers 1201-1206,,the units were given the Class number 206.
The former EMU coach was mostly used for mail traffic, with all doors locked, as there was no corridor connection between it and the former Hastings cars.
However, what do you think of the very uneven track on both lines at the start of this 'Blue Belle' Hastings DEMU video?
I'd have thought we'd only know such things from the US of A, or some Eastern European narrow-gauge forest railways? Really curious and slighly worried; does this part of the line need some urgent work or not, or is this a regular occurrence there, and no one's bothered and there's no issue?
Thank you for your insights!
Perhaps some reballasting or tamping might be advised, though.
This. Optical illusion.
It's worth noting, perhaps, that many of the heritage railways also keep their track and linesides in very good order - mostly, I guess, with volunteer labour.
What makes them look untidy sometimes is the amount of unrestored rolling stock sitting in sidings, though there seems to be an increasing use of plastic (?) sheeting to completely cover up coaches. Given the amount of time required to restore even one coach, this is a Good Idea, and improves the appearance of the yard...