Would Vance be worse than, or less bad than, Trump?

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Comments

  • BoogieBoogie Heaven Host
    Hard to imagine anyone worse than trump.
  • Barnabas62Barnabas62 Shipmate, Host Emeritus
    Pol Pot? Stalin?

    Oh I can imagine a few.
  • windsofchangewindsofchange Shipmate
    edited March 2
    Boogie wrote: »
    Hard to imagine anyone worse than trump.

    Well, the biggest problem with Trump, IMHO -- and strangely, the one thing that gives me a little hope for the future -- is that he isn't just a horrible person and a dangerous dictator, he's a very *charismatic* horrible person and *entertaining* dangerous dictator.

    When he walks off the stage, there will be plenty of understudies as bad or worse than him in terms of policy, etc. But no one else (at the moment) seems to have that undeniable ability to be entertaining while being awful.

    So yeah, let's put Vance out there more often! Once he's the lead, the show will close in three nights!
  • Boogie wrote: »
    Hard to imagine anyone worse than trump.

    Well, the biggest problem with Trump, IMHO -- and strangely, the one thing that gives me a little hope for the future -- is that he isn't just a horrible person and a dangerous dictator, he's a very *charismatic* horrible person and *entertaining* dangerous dictator.

    When he walks off the stage, there will be plenty of understudies as bad or worse than him in terms of policy, etc. But no one else (at the moment) seems to have that undeniable ability to be entertaining while being awful.

    So yeah, let's put Vance out there more often! Once he's the lead, the show will close in three nights!

    Indeed.
    https://forums.shipoffools.com/discussion/comment/718835/#Comment_718835
  • HarryCHHarryCH Shipmate
    Can someone be worse than Trump? Do you mean worse as an individual, or worse historically?
  • stetsonstetson Shipmate
    Barnabas62 wrote: »
    Pol Pot? Stalin?

    Oh I can imagine a few.

    Well, presumably, @Boogie meant the type of individual likely to come to power in the US political system.
  • BoogieBoogie Heaven Host
    Yes - looking to the future.

    I agree with @windsofchange. trump has a weird draw for many in the US. Plus a strange ability to get the whole world talking about him. Meat and drinks to a toddler attention seeker.

    I doubt vance could be worse. But who knows?
  • Barnabas62Barnabas62 Shipmate, Host Emeritus
    stetson wrote: »
    Barnabas62 wrote: »
    Pol Pot? Stalin?

    Oh I can imagine a few.

    Well, presumably, @Boogie meant the type of individual likely to come to power in the US political system.

    By the time Trump and the SCOTUS have finished dismantling the US Constitution, what real defence will exist to protect the USA from an even more extremist populist leader?
  • RuthRuth Shipmate
    None, and the US will be an oligarchy at best.
  • HugalHugal Shipmate
    So could there be some kind of revolution or uprising against Trump. I mean in a land with easy access to guns I hope not, political solutions are much better. But if the American people are pushed far enough could it happen. After the storming a few years ago I am not sure it isn’t.
  • I was surprised TBH that guns were not used in the storming. The mind boggles to imagine the bloodbath that could have ensued if they had been.
  • W HyattW Hyatt Shipmate
    It was a close thing. There were reportedly militia-type groups caching guns outside Washington D.C. in case Trump called on them - see for example Oath Keepers jury hears about massive weapon cache on Jan. 6
    Authorities have alleged the teams and the stockpile of arms were designed to get weapons into Oath Keepers’ hands quickly if they were needed to support a plot to stop the transfer of power from Republican Donald Trump to Democrat Joe Biden.
  • TurquoiseTasticTurquoiseTastic Kerygmania Host
    Why has Marco Rubio sold his soul? He seemed slightly better than that.
  • Nick TamenNick Tamen Shipmate
    Why has Marco Rubio sold his soul? He seemed slightly better than that.
    Reports from Thursday’s cabinet meeting suggest he still has a little bit of backbone, at least where Musk is concerned.


  • TurquoiseTasticTurquoiseTastic Kerygmania Host
    I'd rather he had backbone where Ukraine is concerned, or even just where Trump is concerned. He should resign and be like John Bolton except without being John Bolton.
  • chrisstileschrisstiles Hell Host
    Why has Marco Rubio sold his soul? He seemed slightly better than that.

    What gave you that impression? I'd honestly discourage people from looking at things via a kind of 'shades of grey' framing, the people inside the administration know exactly what it is about, to the extent there is infighting it's largely to protect any part of the state that they currently monopolise.
  • TurquoiseTasticTurquoiseTastic Kerygmania Host
    I mean, why did he sell his soul by accepting a role in the administration. When he was running against Trump in the 2016 primaries he could clearly see that Trump was bad. And he had been strongly pro-Ukraine over the past decade. But he has sold this out to become a despicable lackey.
  • Nick TamenNick Tamen Shipmate
    I mean, why did he sell his soul by accepting a role in the administration. When he was running against Trump in the 2016 primaries he could clearly see that Trump was bad. And he had been strongly pro-Ukraine over the past decade. But he has sold this out to become a despicable lackey.
    He sold out long before accepting a role in the administration.


  • BullfrogBullfrog Shipmate
    Hugal wrote: »
    So could there be some kind of revolution or uprising against Trump. I mean in a land with easy access to guns I hope not, political solutions are much better. But if the American people are pushed far enough could it happen. After the storming a few years ago I am not sure it isn’t.

    The trouble is that the political faction that's most enthusiastic about private gun ownership is also the one that's most loudly in support of the president.

    This is kind of a paradox of American politics. Many of the folks who are most excited by the idea of overthrowing the state with violence are the ones who are most likely to cozy up with a poorly regulated police state.
  • Bullfrog wrote: »
    This is kind of a paradox of American politics. Many of the folks who are most excited by the idea of overthrowing the state with violence are the ones who are most likely to cozy up with a poorly regulated police state.

    Just as long as the police state is persecuting the right sort of people, of course.
  • W Hyatt wrote: »
    It was a close thing. There were reportedly militia-type groups caching guns outside Washington D.C. in case Trump called on them - see for example Oath Keepers jury hears about massive weapon cache on Jan. 6
    Authorities have alleged the teams and the stockpile of arms were designed to get weapons into Oath Keepers’ hands quickly if they were needed to support a plot to stop the transfer of power from Republican Donald Trump to Democrat Joe Biden.

    Plus there were the pipe bombs at the two parties' headquarters, which are still a mystery. The authorities still aren't sure whether they were intended to go off and didn't, or whether they were dummies of some kind to intimidate the party leaders.
  • TurquoiseTasticTurquoiseTastic Kerygmania Host
    An interesting article in the Guardian about Republican Russophilia. The suggestion is that Russia is being re-cast as an "anti-woke" ally, with Trump being the spearhead enabling the culture-war faction of the GOP to establish this new world-view.
  • Putin's MAGA-baiting is just that, it's just for show. It gets him an audience in the West. Witness the Putin-Tucker Carlson interview where he omitted all of it.
  • stetsonstetson Shipmate
    Putin's MAGA-baiting is just that, it's just for show. It gets him an audience in the West. Witness the Putin-Tucker Carlson interview where he omitted all of it.

    By "Putin's MAGA-baiting" you mean Putin trying to sound supportive of MAGA? Because I think "X-baiting" is used to mean that someone is attacking X, eg. "Joe McCarthy was a red-baiter".

    And re: the Putin-Carlson interview, do you mean Putin DIDN'T engage in pro-MAGA rhetoric? That could be. All I really know about that interview is that Putin said Poland had provoked Hitler into war, which was really off-message when he simultaneously whines about Russia being the victim of pro-nazi aggression.
  • Nick TamenNick Tamen Shipmate
    stetson wrote: »
    Putin's MAGA-baiting is just that, it's just for show. It gets him an audience in the West. Witness the Putin-Tucker Carlson interview where he omitted all of it.

    By "Putin's MAGA-baiting" you mean Putin trying to sound supportive of MAGA? Because I think "X-baiting" is used to mean that someone is attacking X, eg. "Joe McCarthy was a red-baiter".
    Not necessarily. “Gay-baiting” and “queer-baiting” refer to when promotional materials for movies, tv shows, books, etc., give the impression that the movie or tv show or book will depict a gay, lesbian or queer romance, sex or whatever, in order to attract a larger audience, but then doesn’t actually deliver what was promised.


  • stetsonstetson Shipmate
    edited March 17
    Nick Tamen wrote: »
    stetson wrote: »
    Putin's MAGA-baiting is just that, it's just for show. It gets him an audience in the West. Witness the Putin-Tucker Carlson interview where he omitted all of it.

    By "Putin's MAGA-baiting" you mean Putin trying to sound supportive of MAGA? Because I think "X-baiting" is used to mean that someone is attacking X, eg. "Joe McCarthy was a red-baiter".
    Not necessarily. “Gay-baiting” and “queer-baiting” refer to when promotional materials for movies, tv shows, books, etc., give the impression that the movie or tv show or book will depict a gay, lesbian or queer romance, sex or whatever, in order to attract a larger audience, but then doesn’t actually deliver what was promised.
    Hm. I stand enlightened.

    A google on "gay-baiting" turns up lots of articles on "queerbaiting". But when I type in
    "gay-baiting politicians", I get articles about antigay politicians.

    Personally, I always found it somewhat odd that "-baiting" was used to mean "-attacking", since bait is something that the targeted entity initially finds attractive. So the use in "queerbaiting" does make more logical sense to me.
  • ArethosemyfeetArethosemyfeet Shipmate, Heaven Host
    stetson wrote: »

    Personally, I always found it odd that "-baiting" was used to mean "-attacking", since bait is something that the targeted entity initially finds attractive. So the use in "queerbaiting" does make more logical sense to me.

    I think the context is bear- or bull-baiting, which is torture masquerading as entertainment.
  • stetsonstetson Shipmate
    edited March 17
    stetson wrote: »

    Personally, I always found it odd that "-baiting" was used to mean "-attacking", since bait is something that the targeted entity initially finds attractive. So the use in "queerbaiting" does make more logical sense to me.

    I think the context is bear- or bull-baiting, which is torture masquerading as entertainment.

    Could be. My impression was that the politician was attacking whatever group, in order to lure them into a public argument that the politician ends up winning(as does happen in a bullfight), with the initial attacks being metaphorized as bait.
  • peasepease Tech Admin
    Bull-baiting is not the same as bull-fighting. In bull-baiting, a bull is intentionally injured, maimed or killed by dogs. In red-baiting, a political opponent is discredited through (alleged) association with left-wing ideology.
  • stetsonstetson Shipmate
    pease wrote: »
    Bull-baiting is not the same as bull-fighting. In bull-baiting, a bull is intentionally injured, maimed or killed by dogs. In red-baiting, a political opponent is discredited through (alleged) association with left-wing ideology.

    Okay, thanks.
  • Gramps49Gramps49 Shipmate
    Guess who has the clear majority in the first Republican primary poll. Yes, the first 2028 Republican Primary poll. It ain't Rubio. https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/republican-2028-primary-polls-what-early-surveys-show/ar-AA1CZADQ?ocid=BingNewsSerp
  • Nick TamenNick Tamen Shipmate
    A poll about the 2028 primate taken in April 2025 is meaningless, at least in terms of what might actually happen in that primary.

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