Purgatory: Oops - your Trump presidency discussion thread.

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  • ArethosemyfeetArethosemyfeet Shipmate, Heaven Host
    Dave W wrote: »
    This is ridiculous. There's no mystery about why vanishingly few Republican politicians are willing to stand up to Trump; he has a 92% approval rating among people who identify themselves as Republicans. No politician who defies the overwhelming sentiments of their constituency could survive a primary challenge.

    Presumably only a fraction of Senators are facing a primary this year, and by now a lot of primaries must have already passed.
  • Golden KeyGolden Key Shipmate, Glory
    A stink has been raised by comments Jared Kushner raised in a Time magazine interview. I'm not sure exactly what he meant, and there are differing opinions. But here's the pertinent part:
    When asked if there was a chance the presidential election could be postponed past November 3 due to the pandemic, Kushner said that isn’t his decision. “I’m not sure I can commit one way or the other, but right now that’s the plan,” he said.

    “Hopefully by the time we get to September, October, November, we’ve done enough work with testing and with all the different things we’re trying to do to prevent a future outbreak of the magnitude that would make us shut down again,” Kushner continued. “I really believe that once America opens up, it’ll be very hard for America to ever lock down again.”

    I certainly wouldn't put it past T to try to delay or skip the general election this fall--particularly if he can say "well, you know we've got some medical experts here--great people, good people--and they say we need to postpone the election. What can I do? I respect their opinion, I really do, and I want to keep you all safe--even the Democrats, what the heck? So I'll just hang out and oversee things until it's safe for all of you to come out into the sunshine. You know, I think I may head down to Mar-a-Lago--it's safe there--and govern from there. Good times."

    I don't know whether J simply meant he doesn't know what's going to happen; or he was signaling that T is floating the idea of a delayed election; or he knows T plans to do it, and J thinks that's a great thing.

    (BTW, the quote is from the very end of the article.)
  • ArethosemyfeetArethosemyfeet Shipmate, Heaven Host
    I don't think Trump can delay the election because it's not one election, it's fifty-one elections and if states don't select their electoral college delegates then they don't get to vote. Attempting to delay the election results in a democratic landslide as red states obey Trump and blue states vote by mail. More likely if conditions are still bad come November the GOP will try to block voting by mail in the swing states so only Trump's most eager Nurgle-cultists will be willing to vote.
  • And has been said here before, Trump's first term expires in January. If there's an election and he wins, he'll get a second term.
  • Simon ToadSimon Toad Shipmate
    Kushner is a dickwit who was playing for time while trying to sound smart. He didn't have an understanding of the legal position.
  • Golden KeyGolden Key Shipmate, Glory
    T mentioned in the past, several times, that maybe he'd stay on past a second term. It's not a new idea for him.

    FG--yes, of course, that's the way it works. (Hopefully, though, he won't win.)
  • Dave WDave W Shipmate
    Dave W wrote: »
    This is ridiculous. There's no mystery about why vanishingly few Republican politicians are willing to stand up to Trump; he has a 92% approval rating among people who identify themselves as Republicans. No politician who defies the overwhelming sentiments of their constituency could survive a primary challenge.

    Presumably only a fraction of Senators are facing a primary this year, and by now a lot of primaries must have already passed.
    About a third of senators are up for re-election every two years; a large majority of their primaries have not yet been held.

    But even aside from primary challenges, I don't think it's hard to understand why Republican politicians who would like to further their careers would be reluctant to defy a Republican president who is overwhelmingly popular with Republican voters. Politics is to some extent a team sport; there's no need to hypothesize a trove of compromising dirty secrets, or blame loyalty to Trump on corporate lobbyists.
  • ArethosemyfeetArethosemyfeet Shipmate, Heaven Host
    Dave W wrote: »
    Dave W wrote: »
    This is ridiculous. There's no mystery about why vanishingly few Republican politicians are willing to stand up to Trump; he has a 92% approval rating among people who identify themselves as Republicans. No politician who defies the overwhelming sentiments of their constituency could survive a primary challenge.

    Presumably only a fraction of Senators are facing a primary this year, and by now a lot of primaries must have already passed.
    About a third of senators are up for re-election every two years; a large majority of their primaries have not yet been held.

    But even aside from primary challenges, I don't think it's hard to understand why Republican politicians who would like to further their careers would be reluctant to defy a Republican president who is overwhelmingly popular with Republican voters. Politics is to some extent a team sport; there's no need to hypothesize a trove of compromising dirty secrets, or blame loyalty to Trump on corporate lobbyists.

    Looks like 15 Republican senators are up for re-election this year, or fewer than a third. That said, I think the "riding the tiger" explanation is probably the correct one.
  • CrœsosCrœsos Shipmate
    Looks like 15 Republican senators are up for re-election this year, or fewer than a third. That said, I think the "riding the tiger" explanation is probably the correct one.

    There are thirty-five U.S. Senate seats up for grabs in 2020; thirty-three regular elections and two special elections in Georgia and Arizona. (This assumes that the FBI doesn't uncover anything that would cause Richard Burr of North Carolina to resign, in which case there would be a third special election in 2020.) Of those thirty-five seats, twenty-three are currently held by Republicans. Eighteen of those twenty-three Republicans are running for re-election, two are running for a first time election after being appointed to fill out someone else's term, while three are hanging it up at the end of their terms leaving open seats in Tennessee, Kansas, and Wyoming.

    There are some analogies to the position the Democrats were in during the 2018 Senate elections, where they had to defend sitting Senators in a lot more states than the Republicans. The main difference is that the Republicans can afford to play defense. They can lose up to two net seats in the Senate and still maintain an outright majority, whereas in 2018 Democrats had to make a net gain in seats to get a Senate majority.
  • Gramps49Gramps49 Shipmate
    Republican seats that are a toss-up:

    Colorado Senator Cory Gardner, R, Colorado--Colorado has become increasingly blue over the past few years.

    Senator Martha McSally R, Arizona. McSally had lost her first bid to become a Senator but then was appointed to the McCain's seat after he died. She is up against the likes of Mark Kelly, a respected Navy veteran and former astronaut who just happens to be married to Gabrielle Giffords, the congresswoman who got shot several years ago.

    Senator Thom Tillis, R, North Carolina The Republican party in NC is increasingly fractured with the pro-Trump people favoring someone else. Moreover, the Democratic party has been gaining ground in NC.

    Susan Collins, R, Maine--a lot of people, particularly women, were upset with Collins' vote for Kavanaugh when he was nominated to the Supreme Court. Moreover, her Democratic opponent has raised more money to spend than Collins. Money can be the deciding factor.

    The one Democratic Seat that could flip is Doug Jones of Alabama. That seat had long been Republican but Jones won the seat in a special election against Roy Moore, who no one really liked. On the other hand, there is a three-way race in the Republican primary for a nominee to challenge Jones. Time will tell.

    There are other Republican seats that could flip, but the above seem to be more likely to flip.
  • CrœsosCrœsos Shipmate
    Gramps49 wrote: »
    The one Democratic Seat that could flip is Doug Jones of Alabama. That seat had long been Republican but Jones won the seat in a special election against Roy Moore, who no one really liked. On the other hand, there is a three-way race in the Republican primary for a nominee to challenge Jones. Time will tell.

    It's a two-way race. The first round of voting was on March 3 and failed to produce a majority winner. The two top vote-getters, former Senator Jefferson Beauregard Sessions III and former college football coach Tommy Tuberville, advanced to the runoff. That was supposed to have happened on March 31 but was re-scheduled for July 14 due to the COVID-19 pandemic.
  • edited May 2020
    Crœsos wrote: »
    Jefferson Beauregard Sessions III

    If I met him at a conference and read his name badge, I wouldn't need to ask which country he came from :smile: (Hey, I like Loudon Wainright - are you related?)
  • EirenistEirenist Shipmate
    According to today's Times, one of the Trump Team has called Obama 'incompetent'. (Rolls eyes.)
  • ArethosemyfeetArethosemyfeet Shipmate, Heaven Host
    Eirenist wrote: »
    According to today's Times, one of the Trump Team has called Obama 'incompetent'. (Rolls eyes.)

    As I've seen commented elsewhere: everything they do or say is projection.
  • Golden KeyGolden Key Shipmate, Glory
    It actually was T who said that. "Grossly incompetent", IIRC.
  • CrœsosCrœsos Shipmate
    edited May 2020
    Golden Key wrote: »
    It actually was T who said that. "Grossly incompetent", IIRC.

    Well, Obama did display a flagrant lack of whiteness during his time in office, which is why Trump and his supporters cast around so wildly looking for something they can use as an explanation without having to come right out and say it.

    Here's a video recounting the biggest scandal of the Obama years. Truly shocking, even after all this time!
  • PigwidgeonPigwidgeon Shipmate
    Crœsos wrote: »
    Here's a video recounting the biggest scandal of the Obama years. Truly shocking, even after all this time!
    I remember that scandal! Perhaps you should have noted that this was NSFW -- the horror of it!

    (And remember when Michelle wore shorts on a family trip to the Grand Canyon! Worse they posing in the nude for magazines!)

  • Gramps49Gramps49 Shipmate
    edited May 2020
    And, as shown at the end of the clip. Reagan often wore a tan suit. Maybe tan suits are reserved for Reaganites.

    Then there was the time when Obama did not put his right hand over his heart when the National Anthem was played. (You are supposed to stand--which he did--but the hand over the heart is optional).

    Or the time when he did not have a flag pin on his lapel. I still wonder where that requirement started.

    But the biggest error was when Obama lampooned T at a dinner by the National Press Association. You could almost see smoke coming out T's ears.

    BTW, if you have Netflix, watch the documentary Becoming which is about Michelle Obama. Great story.
  • PigwidgeonPigwidgeon Shipmate
    This just in from The Washington Post (Trump's least favorite newspaper):
    Trump says he is taking hydroxychloroquine to protect against coronavirus, dismissing safety concerns
    President Trump told reporters Monday that he has been taking the drug for about one and a half weeks and that the White House physician knows he is taking it despite the fact that he continues to test negative for the virus. Clinical trials, academic research and scientific analysis indicate that the danger of the drug is a significantly increased risk of death for certain patients.
    'I think it's good. I've heard a lot of good stories. And if it's not good, I'll tell you right. I'm not going to get hurt by it,' he said.

  • CrœsosCrœsos Shipmate
    Pigwidgeon wrote: »
    This just in from The Washington Post (Trump's least favorite newspaper):
    Trump says . . .

    Everything after that is cast into doubt by those opening two words.

    And Trump is staying on-brand, as expected.
    The aggressive new White House campaign to improve America's perceptions of President Donald Trump's handling of the coronavirus crisis was in full swing Friday -- from the President's sunny predictions in the Rose Garden about developing a vaccine to the press secretary's attempted takedown of the Obama administration's pandemic playbook in the White House briefing room.

    <snip>

    But the administration's aggressive effort to shore up public confidence in the President's handling of the crisis was on display Friday afternoon as Trump appeared in the Rose Garden to turn attention toward his hopes for a vaccine.

    He declared that the administration is "reigniting our economic engines" as most states move toward reopening. He said that America has the "largest and most ambitious testing system in the world" (an echo of the giant "America Leads The World in Testing" campaign-style banners that the White House erected for Monday's briefing). And Trump promised that the administration's vaccine development effort -- "Operation Warp Speed" -- will be "a massive scientific, industrial, and logistical endeavor unlike anything our country has seen since the Manhattan Project."

    "Vaccine or no vaccine, we're back," Trump said Friday. "We think we are going to have a vaccine in the pretty near future, and if we do, we are going to really be a big step ahead, and if we don't, we are going to be like so many other cases where you had a problem come in -- it'll go away at some point, it'll go away."

    Buttressing Trump's attempts to project the image of a more forceful commander in chief, White House Press Secretary Kayleigh McEnany once again used the briefing room to try to recast the history around the Trump administration's inability to contain the spread of the virus -- stepping up efforts to shift blame to the Obama administration for everything from pandemic plans to the depleted Strategic National Stockpile.

    I suppose just dealing effectively with the pandemic would be a simpler option than letting it go unchecked and trying to convince people everything is okay, but that seems an impossibility given Trump's many glaring deficiencies.
  • Is he just straight-up insane, then??
    Pigwidgeon wrote: »
    This just in from The Washington Post (Trump's least favorite newspaper):
    Trump says he is taking hydroxychloroquine to protect against coronavirus, dismissing safety concerns
    President Trump told reporters Monday that he has been taking the drug for about one and a half weeks and that the White House physician knows he is taking it despite the fact that he continues to test negative for the virus. Clinical trials, academic research and scientific analysis indicate that the danger of the drug is a significantly increased risk of death for certain patients.
    'I think it's good. I've heard a lot of good stories. And if it's not good, I'll tell you right. I'm not going to get hurt by it,' he said.

  • HedgehogHedgehog Shipmate
    Is he just straight-up insane, then??
    Pigwidgeon wrote: »
    This just in from The Washington Post (Trump's least favorite newspaper):
    Trump says he is taking hydroxychloroquine to protect against coronavirus, dismissing safety concerns
    President Trump told reporters Monday that he has been taking the drug for about one and a half weeks and that the White House physician knows he is taking it despite the fact that he continues to test negative for the virus. Clinical trials, academic research and scientific analysis indicate that the danger of the drug is a significantly increased risk of death for certain patients.
    'I think it's good. I've heard a lot of good stories. And if it's not good, I'll tell you right. I'm not going to get hurt by it,' he said.
    No, he is a straight-up liar. The best evidence that he is NOT taking hydroxychloroquine is that he says that he is. It is Trump. The wise bet is to assume everything is a lie until proven otherwise.

  • Gramps49Gramps49 Shipmate
    Hedgehog wrote: »
    Is he just straight-up insane, then??
    Pigwidgeon wrote: »
    This just in from The Washington Post (Trump's least favorite newspaper):
    Trump says he is taking hydroxychloroquine to protect against coronavirus, dismissing safety concerns
    President Trump told reporters Monday that he has been taking the drug for about one and a half weeks and that the White House physician knows he is taking it despite the fact that he continues to test negative for the virus. Clinical trials, academic research and scientific analysis indicate that the danger of the drug is a significantly increased risk of death for certain patients.
    'I think it's good. I've heard a lot of good stories. And if it's not good, I'll tell you right. I'm not going to get hurt by it,' he said.
    No, he is a straight-up liar. The best evidence that he is NOT taking hydroxychloroquine is that he says that he is. It is Trump. The wise bet is to assume everything is a lie until proven otherwise.

    I guess if he drops dead and the autopsy shows hydroxychloroquine toxicity I will believe it.

    In other news, AG Barr has said he does not expect to investigate Biden or Obama for any "Obamagate." T was not happy about that. Story here.
  • Golden KeyGolden Key Shipmate, Glory
    What d'you bet that, sometime in the next few months and *definitely* before the election, T will talk about his Operation Warp Speed vaccine project, boast that the virus is mostly or completely gone from America, and proudly say "Mission Accomplished"? (As Dubya did re military action, complete with a banner. And it so wasn't over.)
  • Golden KeyGolden Key Shipmate, Glory
  • Golden Key wrote: »

    There's actually been quite a bit of pushback from Fox News over the last few months -- Trump has even attacked them in some of his Tweets and is pushing the "OAN" as an alternative.

    I mean, if even FOX NEWS is waking up, maybe there's hope ...
  • ArethosemyfeetArethosemyfeet Shipmate, Heaven Host
    What's the betting Trump's doctors are giving him a sugar pill and telling him it's hydroxychloroquine?
  • Simon ToadSimon Toad Shipmate
    My feeling is that Trump has been popping pills and taking whacky stuff all his life. What I don't believe is that he's only been taking that anti-malaria drug for a week and a half. I reckon he's been taking it for the whole year.
  • Golden KeyGolden Key Shipmate, Glory
    I don't know about T taking wacky stuff. He well might. BUT he doesn't drink, because of a long-ago promise to his brother who died from alcoholism.
  • ArethosemyfeetArethosemyfeet Shipmate, Heaven Host
    Golden Key wrote: »
    I don't know about T taking wacky stuff. He well might. BUT he doesn't drink, because of a long-ago promise to his brother who died from alcoholism.

    Who needs drink when you've got Adderall?
  • BoogieBoogie Heaven Host
    Golden Key wrote: »
    I don't know about T taking wacky stuff. He well might. BUT he doesn't drink, because of a long-ago promise to his brother who died from alcoholism.

    Who needs drink when you've got Adderall?

    Please don’t be rude about Adderall before you know what it’s for and what it does.



  • ArethosemyfeetArethosemyfeet Shipmate, Heaven Host
    Boogie wrote: »
    Golden Key wrote: »
    I don't know about T taking wacky stuff. He well might. BUT he doesn't drink, because of a long-ago promise to his brother who died from alcoholism.

    Who needs drink when you've got Adderall?

    Please don’t be rude about Adderall before you know what it’s for and what it does.



    I know it's very useful for folk who have ADHD. I also know that it's long been rumoured that Trump is an abuser of it. I'm not being rude about Adderall, I'm being rude about Trump. Lots of things are useful medications when prescribed appropriately but can be misused.
  • BoogieBoogie Heaven Host
    Boogie wrote: »
    Golden Key wrote: »
    I don't know about T taking wacky stuff. He well might. BUT he doesn't drink, because of a long-ago promise to his brother who died from alcoholism.

    Who needs drink when you've got Adderall?

    Please don’t be rude about Adderall before you know what it’s for and what it does.



    I know it's very useful for folk who have ADHD. I also know that it's long been rumoured that Trump is an abuser of it. I'm not being rude about Adderall, I'm being rude about Trump. Lots of things are useful medications when prescribed appropriately but can be misused.

    Yes, true. I’m very sensitive about people who misunderstand ADHD medications and what they do, how they work.

    Sorry.

    Re: the potus and his approach to medications. I’m utterly dumbfounded. This isn’t a nutter spouting in the pub. This is the ‘leader of the free world’. A world which seems to have forgotten what ‘freedom’ means. :rage:

  • ArethosemyfeetArethosemyfeet Shipmate, Heaven Host
    Boogie wrote: »
    Boogie wrote: »
    Golden Key wrote: »
    I don't know about T taking wacky stuff. He well might. BUT he doesn't drink, because of a long-ago promise to his brother who died from alcoholism.

    Who needs drink when you've got Adderall?

    Please don’t be rude about Adderall before you know what it’s for and what it does.



    I know it's very useful for folk who have ADHD. I also know that it's long been rumoured that Trump is an abuser of it. I'm not being rude about Adderall, I'm being rude about Trump. Lots of things are useful medications when prescribed appropriately but can be misused.

    Yes, true. I’m very sensitive about people who misunderstand ADHD medications and what they do, how they work.

    Sorry.


    No probs. I understand the sensitivity. I've taught enough kids with ADHD to be very grateful for the effect of medication (not sure if Adderall in their case but probably the same class of drugs) and heard from enough adults about the profound effect it had on their ability to function. Trump, on the other hand, is rumoured to have been snorting the stuff in between popping Sudafed.
  • Barnabas62Barnabas62 Shipmate, Host Emeritus
    I buy Arethosemyfeet's explanation.
    What's the betting Trump's doctors are giving him a sugar pill and telling him it's hydroxychloroquine?

    Probably specially embossed sugar pills? And the GOP still keep their heads down about his irresponsible craziness.
  • And it would have to be a Biglier Sugar Pill than anyone else's, or perhaps even TWO Pills...

    Republicans (well, the sensible ones) now know what it is to ride on the back of a tiger.
  • OhherOhher Shipmate
    Boogie wrote: »
    This isn’t a nutter spouting in the pub. This is the ‘leader of the free world’. A world which seems to have forgotten what ‘freedom’ means. :rage:

    A. Quite possibly, this IS a "nutter speaking," though from the White House rather than the pub.

    B. I'm not sure the problem here is people having "forgotten what freedom means." Rather, it's people forgetting that freedom is a social, not an individual, construct.

    The isolated individual is by definition free; what limits can possibly exist on her behavior beyond those she chooses or rejects?

    It's only when we live with and among others that we find it necessary or at least convenient to accommodating others' wishes, limits, needs, and demands.

    Of course, the kicker is that humans, developmentally speaking, are completely incapable of surviving in isolation. Where we get this persistent fantasy that somehow we can and manage to nurture this notion is a puzzle.


  • Barnabas62 wrote: »
    I buy Arethosemyfeet's explanation.
    What's the betting Trump's doctors are giving him a sugar pill and telling him it's hydroxychloroquine?

    Probably specially embossed sugar pills? And the GOP still keep their heads down about his irresponsible craziness.

    So HE's ok, being protected from his own ignorance and stupidity by people who know better but he's advising other people he's taking it to protect him and a number will accept that and not be protected but take risks on the presumption of their protection.
  • ArethosemyfeetArethosemyfeet Shipmate, Heaven Host
    Barnabas62 wrote: »
    I buy Arethosemyfeet's explanation.
    What's the betting Trump's doctors are giving him a sugar pill and telling him it's hydroxychloroquine?

    Probably specially embossed sugar pills? And the GOP still keep their heads down about his irresponsible craziness.

    So HE's ok, being protected from his own ignorance and stupidity by people who know better but he's advising other people he's taking it to protect him and a number will accept that and not be protected but take risks on the presumption of their protection.

    It would, if accurate, be of a piece with the many other ways in which people close to Trump trying to mitigate his worst impulses end up contributing to the damage on the broader scale.
  • Gramps49Gramps49 Shipmate
    Barnabas62 wrote: »
    I buy Arethosemyfeet's explanation.
    What's the betting Trump's doctors are giving him a sugar pill and telling him it's hydroxychloroquine?

    Probably specially embossed sugar pills? And the GOP still keep their heads down about his irresponsible craziness.

    So HE's ok, being protected from his own ignorance and stupidity by people who know better but he's advising other people he's taking it to protect him and a number will accept that and not be protected but take risks on the presumption of their protection.

    It would, if accurate, be of a piece with the many other ways in which people close to Trump trying to mitigate his worst impulses end up contributing to the damage on the broader scale.

    Remember T's random thoughts about taking disinfectant orally to kill the virus? Time Magazine reported disinfectant poisoning went up 125% in April. Likewise, just by saying he is taking hydroxychloroquine, there will be an increase in its abuse this month.

    Meanwhile

    Talking Points Memo is reporting T will not hold a ceremony for the unveiling of President Obama's official portrait in the White House. That's okay, Obama did not want to sit through such a ceremony in T's White House. They will probably have to wait until Biden gets into the office.
  • Barnabas62Barnabas62 Shipmate, Host Emeritus
    So HE's ok, being protected from his own ignorance and stupidity by people who know better but he's advising other people he's taking it to protect him and a number will accept that and not be protected but take risks on the presumption of their protection.
    Pretty much. 90% of GOP voters think the sun shines out of his ass so the GOP elected representatives stay on the bandwagon.

    And if a rank and file GOP member or two dies as a result of listening to him, some prat in the alt-right will be ready with an exonerating conspiracy theory.

    The bubble will burst some day ....
  • Gramps49Gramps49 Shipmate
    The bubble will burst some day ....

    3 Nov. 2020
  • It had better.
  • Gramps49Gramps49 Shipmate
    T is going wild today. Several states have decided to switch their voting to mail ballots.

    Idaho is one of the recent states. It is currently conducting primary voting. It is reporting the turn-out has been significantly higher, approaching what they would expect for a presidential primary election.

    T is not happy with this because he fears the more people that use mail ballots will mean his chances of being re-elected will go down.

    He is now threatening to withhold federal aid to states under the Voter Fraud Act which was designed to discourage fraudulent voting.

    The deal of it is, vote by mail is a proven technology. Our military has voted this way ever since the Civil War. Several states, notably Oregon and Washington, have done this for about 20 some years now with practically no problems.

    Even T himself votes by mail.



  • CrœsosCrœsos Shipmate
    Gramps49 wrote: »
    T is not happy with this because he fears the more people that use mail ballots will mean his chances of being re-elected will go down.

    He is now threatening to withhold federal aid to states under the Voter Fraud Act which was designed to discourage fraudulent voting.

    I guess the question is "why wouldn't he?" He was already impeached for using the powers of his office to attempt electoral fraud and it was demonstrated that no one with the power to stop him was willing to do so. Those whose memories stretch all the way back to those remote days of . . . [ checks notes ] . . . last December may remember this exact scenario being discussed at the impeachment hearings in the House Judiciary Committee. Here's Pamela Karlan with a prescient explanation:
    But that distortion is magnified if a sitting President abuses the powers of his office actually to invite foreign intervention. To see why, imagine living in a part of Louisiana or Texas that’s prone to devastating hurricanes and flooding. What would you think if you lived there, and your governor asked for a meeting with the president to discuss getting disaster aid that Congress has provided for. What would you think if that President said, “‘I would like you to do us a favor.’ I’ll meet with you and I'll send the disaster relief once you brand my opponent a criminal.”? Wouldn’t you know in your gut that such a president had abused his office, that he betrayed the national interest, and that he was trying to corrupt the electoral process?

    So again, a president using the powers of his office to skew an election in which he is running was greenlit as okay by every Republican in the U.S. Senate other than Mitt Romney.
  • Golden KeyGolden Key Shipmate, Glory
    Perhaps he's against vote-by-mail because it's harder to hack and mess with?

    In the wake of the 2000 US election and Bush v. Gore, a woman looked into the problems, creating both the site and the book "Black Box Voting". The site's book page and the About section (lower on the page) is the easiest way to learn about it. And you can download the first edition of the book free.

    It looks like the site is no longer active. IIRC, I heard Ms. Harris had moved on to another venue or project. But it's still a good way to understand what miscreants have done behind the scenes.

    And might do again.
  • Gramps49Gramps49 Shipmate
    Golden Key wrote: »
    Perhaps he's against vote-by-mail because it's harder to hack and mess with?

    In the wake of the 2000 US election and Bush v. Gore, a woman looked into the problems, creating both the site and the book "Black Box Voting". The site's book page and the About section (lower on the page) is the easiest way to learn about it. And you can download the first edition of the book free.

    It looks like the site is no longer active. IIRC, I heard Ms. Harris had moved on to another venue or project. But it's still a good way to understand what miscreants have done behind the scenes.

    And might do again.

    I was just able to download the whole book. Diebold is owned by a very conservative person. Many of the electronic voting machines were produced by Diebold.

    Now, T is threatening to withhold federal funds to Nevada who also has decided to go the vote by mail system too.

    I had mentioned Idaho going that way. I find it interesting T is not threatening Idaho the way he has threatened Michigan or Nevada. I wonder why. Is it because Idaho is in the solid red category whereas Nevada and Michigan could be swing states? Is it because Idaho's has only four electoral votes? Nevada has six. Michigan has sixteen.

    In other news

    Here is an interesting article on T's religious roots that may explain T's approach to the coronavirus. However, I think Norman Vincent Peale only fed into T's underlying narcissism.
  • Simon ToadSimon Toad Shipmate
    Crœsos wrote: »
    Gramps49 wrote: »
    T is not happy with this because he fears the more people that use mail ballots will mean his chances of being re-elected will go down.

    He is now threatening to withhold federal aid to states under the Voter Fraud Act which was designed to discourage fraudulent voting.

    I guess the question is "why wouldn't he?" He was already impeached for using the powers of his office to attempt electoral fraud and it was demonstrated that no one with the power to stop him was willing to do so. Those whose memories stretch all the way back to those remote days of . . . [ checks notes ] . . . last December may remember this exact scenario being discussed at the impeachment hearings in the House Judiciary Committee. Here's Pamela Karlan with a prescient explanation:
    But that distortion is magnified if a sitting President abuses the powers of his office actually to invite foreign intervention. To see why, imagine living in a part of Louisiana or Texas that’s prone to devastating hurricanes and flooding. What would you think if you lived there, and your governor asked for a meeting with the president to discuss getting disaster aid that Congress has provided for. What would you think if that President said, “‘I would like you to do us a favor.’ I’ll meet with you and I'll send the disaster relief once you brand my opponent a criminal.”? Wouldn’t you know in your gut that such a president had abused his office, that he betrayed the national interest, and that he was trying to corrupt the electoral process?

    So again, a president using the powers of his office to skew an election in which he is running was greenlit as okay by every Republican in the U.S. Senate other than Mitt Romney.

    I am tempted to re-post this ad infinitum, but I reckon most people here get it.
  • Simon ToadSimon Toad Shipmate
    Gramps wrote:
    Here is an interesting article on T's religious roots that may explain T's approach to the coronavirus. However, I think Norman Vincent Peale only fed into T's underlying narcissism.

    It may well be that Trump is an aficionado of this positive thinking stuff, but his saying 'the virus will just go away' isn't something I have an issue with. For Trump and me and others with no firm grasp on medicine, it will just go away. There will be a vaccine and like Polio, Measles, and numerous other viruses and diseases, for us in the first world, it will indeed just go away. It will just go away because we won't be thinking about it, and it won't be in the news. So from Trump's standpoint, and mine for that matter, Covid will 'just go away'.

    I am much more concerned about Trump's other positive thinking strategies, like repeatedly lying about his enemies and undermining congressional and executive mechanisms for oversight of Government, and threatening people.

    Trump never used to exist for me. He was just a butt of other people's jokes. I am very much hoping that for me, he will sooner or later just go away.
  • Anybody who runs for office--hell, anybody who takes any job with responsibility for the welfare of other human beings--has a downright fucking DUTY to get past the childhood "it'll go away sooner or later" mindset. That indulgence is only open to people who can't hurt others by their actions or inaction.

    (Which, incidentally, is why virtually no adult American can indulge that dream about Trump. As voters, we have to MAKE him go away--and that requires planning.)
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