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Heaven: 2021 Proof Americans and Brits speak a different language

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  • KarlLBKarlLB Shipmate
    edited June 2021
    KarlLB wrote: »
    Taps

    Yes. A hot one and a cold one. Unless you've got single handle tap.

    Continuing on a watery theme, we're getting eavestroughs replaced soon. I think this isn't the term for these everywhere.

    Despite the usual assumption, mixer taps are becoming the norm now.
  • KarlLB wrote: »
    Taps

    Yes. A hot one and a cold one. Unless you've got single handle tap.

    Continuing on a watery theme, we're getting eavestroughs replaced soon. I think this isn't the term for these everywhere.
    I assume your eavestroughs are what we call gutters.

    As for “tap,” that’s one of those words that folks here know what it means but generally don’t use. We do refer to “tap water,” though. But otherwise, the thing the water comes out of is a faucet (particularly inside the house) or a spigot (pronounced “spi-ket,” and particularly used for such a thing on the exterior of a house or building).

  • EnochEnoch Shipmate
    Spigot, pronounced spĭgǝt, is only used here for the wooden tap that is stuck into a barrel.

  • Gee DGee D Shipmate
    Nick Tamen wrote: »
    I assume your eavestroughs are what we call gutters.

    As do we - gutters or guttering.
  • edited June 2021
    Spigot is like above, stuck into a barrel. Into the bung. Which leads to constipation - bunged up.

    A gutter is the drainage beside a curb on a road. Gutter is also used to refer to rudeness and rude people. Or someone who's ruined their life. Gutter talk. He's in the gutter. That sort of thing.
  • A gutter is the drainage beside a curb on a road. Gutter is also used to refer to rudeness and rude people. Or someone who's ruined their life. Gutter talk. He's in the gutter. That sort of thing.
    Gutter is also used here to mean the drainage along a curb, and related to that, we speak of “gutter talk,” meaning vulgarity. It’s not used to mean rudeness, and definitely isn’t used here to mean a person in any way.

  • cgichardcgichard Shipmate
    Not to mention the "gutter press". Or is that expression outmoded or even unknown nowadays?
  • SojournerSojourner Shipmate
    It’s alive and well
  • Gee DGee D Shipmate
    Sojourner wrote: »
    It’s alive and well

    Very necessarily so (the term, that is, not the press it describes)!

    Drains at the side of roads etc are gutters here.
  • Spigot is like above, stuck into a barrel. Into the bung. Which leads to constipation - bunged up.

    In the case of wooden beer barrels the spigot is usually placed in one of the flat ends, while the bunghole is bored into the widest part of the curved barrel sides, for ease of draining/cleaning. The barrels are propped on their sides, as seen here.

  • CathscatsCathscats Shipmate
    We call house gutters rhones. Mr. Cats spends hours several times a year clearing the rhones.
  • Gee DGee D Shipmate
    A new word for us. Do you feel able to say where you're from, even in pretty general terms?
  • Now, we could get into a spelling war over that. Perhaps it's because we talk about some things and hardly ever see them in print, but for some reason I had it in my head that the rone is the gutter and the rone pipe is the down pipe. (However, I am sure we can all agree that the Rhone valley is a good source of cheap red wine).

    Somewhat related, I once mentioned to an architect (this is in Canada) that the sarking boards on our roof would need some work, and he was baffled. Then, "You mean the decking", he said.
  • FWIW, The Wiki says this about “rain gutters”:
    Water from a pitched roof flows down into a valley gutter, a parapet gutter or an eaves gutter. An eaves gutter is also known as an eavestrough (especially in Canada), rhone (Scotland), eaves-shoot (Ireland) eaves channel, dripster, guttering, rainspouting or simply as a gutter. The word gutter derives from Latin gutta (noun), meaning "a droplet".
    (Citations omitted.)

  • Penny SPenny S Shipmate
    edited June 2021
    There is such a thing, or was, as a guttersnipe, cognate with raggamuffin, urchin, or other word for child found in the street and possibly associated with Fagin. Somehow, the first word seems to associate itself in my mind, more than the others, with dripping nose and wiping snot on the sleeve, possibly because of the association with drip.
  • BroJamesBroJames Purgatory Host
    The online Dictionary of the Scots Language offers
    RONE, n.1 Also rhone, roan, ronn; roun; rune.
  • Penny SPenny S Shipmate
    I wonder if it's related to the Somerset word "rhyne" for a drain, as in artificial watercourse carrying water from a marsh.
  • A roan for me is a horse colouration.

    "Out of the rain and into the gutter" is like "out of the pot and into the fire". Particularly because the vision of the gutter is full of dirt and whatever else might be draining at roadside.
  • CathscatsCathscats Shipmate
    Could well be spelled rone (though spell check wants to auto correct it to Rome) As you say @Stercus Tauri I haven’t seen it written. @Gee D it might be a Scottish usage, as that is where I am.
  • Gee DGee D Shipmate
    Cathscats wrote: »
    Could well be spelled rone (though spell check wants to auto correct it to Rome) As you say @Stercus Tauri I haven’t seen it written. @Gee D it might be a Scottish usage, as that is where I am.

    Thanks, I'd never heard of it. The colour for horses, yes, but not in this usage.
  • EnochEnoch Shipmate
    edited June 2021
    To me, 'gutter' means both the trough that runs along below the eaves, and the drainage trough at the side of a road. The gutter below the eaves carries the water to a downpipe that takes it to a ground level drain. I've not encountered 'rhone' before. I think that may be specifically Scots.

    'Rhyne', by the way, for those that haven't met it before, is pronounced 'rheen' round where I am. It doesn't rhyme with Rhine.

    'Decking' here means a flat surface of wood outside ones house that one puts garden tables, chairs, parasols etc on, i.e. a patio with a wooden floor rather than tiles, paving stones etc.

    'Sarking board' is a new one on me. I'm not sure I can even guess what it means. Looking it up implies it could mean roofing felt. Alternatively does it mean what I'd normally call 'barge boards' which run up the outside edges of the gable end of a roof to protect the eaves from the weather.

  • Deck, not decking for this Canadian. More often now made out of composite: recycled plastic combined with wood fibres.

    I looked up "sarking board". Here on top of roof trusses (generally they are very large pre-made triangles that form the roof of a house), sheathing is put. Sheathing is OSB (oriented strand board, 4'x8' or 4'x12'), meaning that wood bits were combined in layers with glues. But different than chip board which isn't in layers. OSB doesn't need roofing felt. It's already treated and better than older ways. The rules are pretty strict, the wood components have to be certified for what they're being used for.
  • BroJamesBroJames Purgatory Host
    Sarking, whether board or other materials is a layer immediately underneath the tiles or slates etc. in a roof construction. It is not usually visible outside the finished roof.
  • orfeoorfeo Suspended
    Deck, not decking for this Canadian.

    Here, a "deck" would be something that you had made out of "decking".

  • BroJames wrote: »
    Sarking, whether board or other materials is a layer immediately underneath the tiles or slates etc. in a roof construction. It is not usually visible outside the finished roof.

    That is exactly my understanding of it - as in solid boards - but it was unknown to my architect friend.
  • orfeo wrote: »
    Deck, not decking for this Canadian.

    Here, a "deck" would be something that you had made out of "decking".

    We make them out of deck boards.

    Something all fancy, including a well dressed person, or something with all the options is "all decked out".
  • EirenistEirenist Shipmate
    The colour for horses is 'roan'.
    'Give my roan horse a drench.' Shakespeare, Henry IV Part I. Prince Hal, parodying Harry Hotspur.
  • FirenzeFirenze Shipmate, Host Emeritus
    "I suppose you dragged yourselves up on deck?

    Oh no, we dressed quite casual".
  • orfeo wrote: »
    Deck, not decking for this Canadian.

    Here, a "deck" would be something that you had made out of "decking".
    Same here (American South).

  • Taps is a bugle call indicating lights out.
  • edited June 2021
    It's got words "day is done, gone the sun, from the lakes, from the hills, from the sky, all is well, safely rest, god is neigh (or "nice").

    Never heard it as a bugle thing until much later. We sang this at bedtime when I was young, later at summer camp, and later still when I worked at camps. Also sang it to my children. It's a nice little song for after prayers and tucking in.
  • Gee DGee D Shipmate
    edited June 2021
    Mistake
  • Gee DGee D Shipmate
    It's got words "day is done, gone the sun, from the lakes, from the hills, from the sky, all is well, safely rest, god is neigh (or "nice")..

    Neigh or nigh?
  • BroJamesBroJames Purgatory Host
    mousethief wrote: »
    Taps is a bugle call indicating lights out.
    One of the suggested origins for taps that Wikipedia gives is a
    Dutch custom, called taptoe, from which comes the term tattoo as in Military tattoo. The taptoe was also used to signal the end of the day, but originated from a signal that beer taps had to be shut, hence that the day had ended. It comes from the Dutch phrase Doe den tap toe, meaning "Close the tap".
  • Curiosity killedCuriosity killed Shipmate
    edited June 2021
    We sing that Canadian version of taps in the GirlGuide unit I volunteer at, with actions (and seas not lakes and nigh not neigh). Well, currently we mime it on Zoom.

    Taps is recognised in that military sense here too, and in GirlGuiding there is a standard UK version more usually sung, while saluting, at night on camp or at the end of a session. It has a different tune too.
  • BroJames wrote: »
    mousethief wrote: »
    Taps is a bugle call indicating lights out.
    One of the suggested origins for taps that Wikipedia gives is a
    Dutch custom, called taptoe, from which comes the term tattoo as in Military tattoo. The taptoe was also used to signal the end of the day, but originated from a signal that beer taps had to be shut, hence that the day had ended. It comes from the Dutch phrase Doe den tap toe, meaning "Close the tap".

    That sounds verrrrry urban legend.
  • EirenistEirenist Shipmate
    'Last Post' in the British forces.
  • FirenzeFirenze Shipmate, Host Emeritus
    They throw your fedora
    Wherever the floor is
    And start doing horas
    And taps


    I tried tap dancing, but I kept falling in the bath.
  • Gee DGee D Shipmate
    mousethief wrote: »
    BroJames wrote: »
    mousethief wrote: »
    Taps is a bugle call indicating lights out.
    One of the suggested origins for taps that Wikipedia gives is a
    Dutch custom, called taptoe, from which comes the term tattoo as in Military tattoo. The taptoe was also used to signal the end of the day, but originated from a signal that beer taps had to be shut, hence that the day had ended. It comes from the Dutch phrase Doe den tap toe, meaning "Close the tap".

    That sounds verrrrry urban legend.

    Very much so indeed.

    The true origin of the term is that calling it taps meant that the day's business was over, and that it was now time to go home, have a shower and freshen up for dinner. Having a shower involved turning on the shower taps.
  • According to this site (link to History.com) originally the lights out signal was a drum beat, replaced by the bugle. The drum beats were called taps, so the bugle call continued to be.

    The traditional Guide taps with actions (YouTube link).
  • Penny SPenny S Shipmate
    edited June 2021
    We used to live downhill from the military school in Dover, and could hear Last Post, every night. Which is why I can whistle it.
  • CaissaCaissa Shipmate
    We ended our cubs meetings with Taps. (early 1970s).
  • According to this site (link to History.com) originally the lights out signal was a drum beat, replaced by the bugle. The drum beats were called taps, so the bugle call continued to be.
    That’s what the Online Etymology Dictionary says too.

  • BroJamesBroJames Purgatory Host
    mousethief wrote: »
    BroJames wrote: »
    mousethief wrote: »
    Taps is a bugle call indicating lights out.
    One of the suggested origins for taps that Wikipedia gives is a
    Dutch custom, called taptoe, from which comes the term tattoo as in Military tattoo. The taptoe was also used to signal the end of the day, but originated from a signal that beer taps had to be shut, hence that the day had ended. It comes from the Dutch phrase Doe den tap toe, meaning "Close the tap".

    That sounds verrrrry urban legend.
    Maybe, though it is supported by Merriam Webster which tracks back to orders by George Washington that
    Reveille will beat at day-break; the troop at 8 in the morning; the retreat at sunset and taproot nine o'Clock in the evening
    .

  • It's called "Day is Done", not Taps in my locale.
  • BroJamesBroJames Purgatory Host
    I din't notice in time that autocorrect turned 'taptoo at' into 'taproot' :unamused:

    The quotation should have read to orders by George Washington that
    Reveille will beat at day-break; the troop at 8 in the morning; the retreat at sunset and taptoo at nine o'Clock in the evening.
  • It's called "Day is Done", not Taps in my locale.
    The bugle tune dates back at least to the American Civil War, and was formally recognized by the US Military in the 1870s. “Day is Done” is one of several lyrics written for Taps later on.

  • BroJames wrote: »
    mousethief wrote: »
    BroJames wrote: »
    mousethief wrote: »
    Taps is a bugle call indicating lights out.
    One of the suggested origins for taps that Wikipedia gives is a
    Dutch custom, called taptoe, from which comes the term tattoo as in Military tattoo. The taptoe was also used to signal the end of the day, but originated from a signal that beer taps had to be shut, hence that the day had ended. It comes from the Dutch phrase Doe den tap toe, meaning "Close the tap".

    That sounds verrrrry urban legend.
    Maybe, though it is supported by Merriam Webster which tracks back to orders by George Washington that
    Reveille will beat at day-break; the troop at 8 in the morning; the retreat at sunset and taproot nine o'Clock in the evening
    .

    That says nothing about beer.
  • BroJamesBroJames Purgatory Host
    But it does have George Washington refer to that final call, now known as ‘taps’ and calling it ‘taptoo’, which coheres with the idea that it comes from the C17th Dutch/Flemish phrase doe den tap toe ("turn off the tap"). And see these two Wiki articles: Taps; tattoo
  • It does sound like an urban legend. But in this case I'm inclined to believe it. The Dutch word "taptoe" (pronounced "tap too") does mean tattoo in the military sense, both the grand military parade and the signal at the end of the day. Reputable Dutch etymological sources all agree on the origin being in beer taps being closed, and I don't think it's a stretch to imagine how this would become "taps" in parts of the English speaking world.
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