It is with some trepidation I dip my toe ito this thread. I have, since before the 2016 election, I have wondered how anyone could vote for (to me) the evil Mr Trump. The 'Church Times' this week has an article with the following observation that (perhaps) goes some way to explaining his appeal. Viz:
'No one seriously believes that he is very religious. Besides his multiple divorces, serial adulteries, and multiple felonies, his theological ignorance is notorious . . . Mr Trump’s relationship to Evangelicals — working-class, disproportionately rural, and socially conservative — is, unsurprisingly, transactional. They support him because they trust him to deliver. Mr Trump promised them that he would appoint conservative Supreme Court justices who would overturn Roe v. Wade, the 1973 ruling that legalised abortion; and he did. They trust him to deliver the goods that they most desire — low taxes, cheap gas, and well-paid grunt work for males — and to re-establish the traditional society that they want, where women breed, men fight, and Big Men rule. Evangelical theologians compare Mr Trump to Cyrus, the Persian king, who, although a pagan, delivered the Jews from their Babylonian captivity'.
Does this make sense to US shipmates?
Last Friday I met,by chance,in St Andrews, an American couple holidaying in Scotland.I asked them why it took so long to prepare for a Presidential election. I didn't ask who they would be voting for, nor why ,but unbidden the woman told me that Trump was a business man, used to getting things done, which was ,according to her, how 'things should be done.' Again, according to this lady, the others in politics in the USA were all professional politicians who were only interested in their professional careers.
I wished the couple a pleasant time on the golf course and a safe return home.
In a word, yes. In more than a word, and not a little bit snarkily WELCOME TO THE SHOW! The problem is that Tr*mp didn't deliver Conservative-level "low(-er) taxes" to most of the country -- just the uber wealthy and corporations. A lot of his base still believe the myth of Trickle-down Economics from the Reagan years, that being a function of MAGA being, in general, less educated and/or informed beyond their immediate environments (which is how Tr*mp wants them). Gas prices, complex as they are, further exacerbated via pandemic, were actually higher during Tr*mpism. And his track record re: "well-paid grunt work for males" is as fraught as any of his efforts at anything. As far as the "traditional society" is concerned, The Church Times does itself a disservice. It's actually Conservative Evangelical American Theocracy at its worst, and though I still can't believe it, those MAGA idiots actually wrote it all down for everyone: it's called Project 25, and while getting less play in the mainstream media than it should, I think it's a strong reason why Harris will win by far better margins than projected.
The law of unintended consequences ensres that any government, however benevolent in intention, does some harm. One can foresee what harm a Trump/Vance administration might do. This is not the case with a Harris/Walz admlnixtration. I do not possess an enchanted crystal ball or time machine, so must decline The Riv's challenge.
I can pretty much guarantee a Harris administration will keep supplying Israel with munitions to kill children, but that is harm that any US administration would do.
I can pretty much guarantee a Harris administration will keep supplying Israel with munitions to kill children, but that is harm that any US administration would do.
I am thinking while Harris will continue to defend Israel, she will begin to reduce the number of offensive munitions Israel will receive.
VP Harris has very recently said: “This year has been difficult, given the scale of death and destruction in Gaza and given the civilian casualties and displacement in Lebanon, it is devastating. And as president, I will do everything in my power to end the war in Gaza, to bring home the hostages, end the suffering in Gaza, ensure Israel is secure, and ensure the Palestinian people can realize their right to dignity, freedom, security and self-determination,”
Like everything else, she has to be elected first, but this is the tone.
I can pretty much guarantee a Harris administration will keep supplying Israel with munitions to kill children, but that is harm that any US administration would do.
Historically US administrations have been rather more restrained than the Biden one, it remains to be seen whether things are likely to change under Harris/Walz.
But the question was posed as an absolute rather than a relative one.
I’m optimistic today. Gonna go ahead and predict a decisive Harris/Walz victory.
Let’s GO!
From your mouth . . . !
I find myself cautiously optimistic today, too. That’s primarily based on how it seems the Harris and Trump campaigns have been behaving and reacting over the last few days (including here in North Carolina). There seems to be more confidence in the Harris campaign and less confidence in the Trump campaign.
Or that could totally be my imagination, aka wishful thinking.
As I said, it’s cautious optimism. Lord knows, there have been plenty of elections in the past where my optimism was totally unfounded.
I can pretty much guarantee a Harris administration will keep supplying Israel with munitions to kill children, but that is harm that any US administration would do.
US foreign policy always sucks, and people always suffer as a result. From one administration to the next the differences are in the degree of suckage and sometimes who in particular suffers. The only time I think I've factored in foreign policy in choosing a candidate was in the 2008 presidential primary, when I went with Obama instead of H. Clinton because she had voted for the war and he had spoken against it. Obama didn't close the detention camp at Guantanamo, conducted drone strikes in Pakistan and Yemen, including on civilians, and sent bunker buster bombs to Israel. And didn't exactly cover himself in glory with how he handled Syria. And other shit I'm just not remembering at the moment.
I posted this on our mobile home park Facebook page, and two people asked if they could come by. One I knew the other I did not.
Voteing can be stressful. I will be home at #34 on Tuesday, Wednesday, and Thursday with a cup of tea and a listening ear for anyone who needs to decompress, no matter who you voted for. We are neighbors and in this together.
Thanks, Nick. I feel that hellish forces outside are trying to separate us and build on us fearing each other. I'm just trying to support my neighbors and build some bridges with those I disagree with. I think most are good people who have been taken in.
I find myself cautiously optimistic today, too. . . . .
As I said, it’s cautious optimism. Lord knows, there have been plenty of elections in the past where my optimism was totally unfounded.
My wife was talking to a friend this morning, who said she was feeling “nauseously optimistic.”
We think that’s a very apt way to describe how we feel.
I find myself cautiously optimistic today, too. . . . .
As I said, it’s cautious optimism. Lord knows, there have been plenty of elections in the past where my optimism was totally unfounded.
My wife was talking to a friend this morning, who said she was feeling “nauseously optimistic.”
We think that’s a very apt way to describe how we feel.
BTW, my Pilates instructor and her family have recently come back from a visit to Disneyland Florida, and she remarked on how polarised the US seems to be...
Interesting observation: in 2016 the polls had Trump at 47%. 2020 had it at 47% In one cycle he won only through the electoral college. In the other he lost by a landslide.
This has been a long day. Aside from the presidential race, we had some other significant races with nightmarish Republican candidates here in North Carolina—governor and superintendent of public instruction in particular. It’s going to be a long night, too, I suspect.
There is a real possibility that I may just go to bed early and read my book (which in a weirdly disturbing, weirdly sort-of-reassuring way is reminding me that the kind of Bad that Trump could bring is just the latest version of Bad that we’ve seen and ultimately survived*
before), and then deal with whatever in the morning.
*Survived, but not without a lot of damage and injustice that we still haven’t truly recovered from.
I am just going to go to bed, trusting that if anything really dramatic happens, for good or ill, my daughter who stays up all night watching the returns, will phone me.
Anyone else having periodic flashes of realisation of yet more things Trump is going to fuck up? I'm not going to list them as I don't want to make people feel worse but, yeah, every few minutes I think "damnit, that too".
Anyone else having periodic flashes of realisation of yet more things Trump is going to fuck up? I'm not going to list them as I don't want to make people feel worse but, yeah, every few minutes I think "damnit, that too".
"The World".
It's a pretty big thing, to be sure, but at least it's only one thing.
Anyone else having periodic flashes of realisation of yet more things Trump is going to fuck up? I'm not going to list them as I don't want to make people feel worse but, yeah, every few minutes I think "damnit, that too".
"The World".
It's a pretty big thing, to be sure, but at least it's only one thing.
I dunno, the Sentinelese might make it through largely unscathed.
What really, really bothers me is the alliance of Musk and Trump. I'm sure I could make '666' out of their names.
Hmmmm ..... courage, shipmates, courage!
There is a real possibility that I may just go to bed early and read my book (which in a weirdly disturbing, weirdly sort-of-reassuring way is reminding me that the kind of Bad that Trump could bring is just the latest version of Bad that we’ve seen and ultimately survived*
before), and then deal with whatever in the morning.
*Survived, but not without a lot of damage and injustice that we still haven’t truly recovered from.
Anyone else having periodic flashes of realisation of yet more things Trump is going to fuck up? I'm not going to list them as I don't want to make people feel worse but, yeah, every few minutes I think "damnit, that too".
The Senate could have ended this four years ago by voting to impeach and to deny him the right to run ever again. Let's see what happens when he pardons and releases all the January 6 criminal insurrectionists. If I were a senator I'd be afraid, very afraid. Shoo, I'm just a lowly citizen and I'm afraid, very afraid. Would New Zealand take me, do you think?
The Senate could have ended this four years ago by voting to impeach and to deny him the right to run ever again. Let's see what happens when he pardons and releases all the January 6 criminal insurrectionists. If I were a senator I'd be afraid, very afraid. Shoo, I'm just a lowly citizen and I'm afraid, very afraid. Would New Zealand take me, do you think?
From what friends in NZ are telling me their current government isn't exactly a ray of sunshine either. Currently trying to tear up the treaty with the Maori.
Comments
'No one seriously believes that he is very religious. Besides his multiple divorces, serial adulteries, and multiple felonies, his theological ignorance is notorious . . . Mr Trump’s relationship to Evangelicals — working-class, disproportionately rural, and socially conservative — is, unsurprisingly, transactional. They support him because they trust him to deliver. Mr Trump promised them that he would appoint conservative Supreme Court justices who would overturn Roe v. Wade, the 1973 ruling that legalised abortion; and he did. They trust him to deliver the goods that they most desire — low taxes, cheap gas, and well-paid grunt work for males — and to re-establish the traditional society that they want, where women breed, men fight, and Big Men rule. Evangelical theologians compare Mr Trump to Cyrus, the Persian king, who, although a pagan, delivered the Jews from their Babylonian captivity'.
Does this make sense to US shipmates?
To our prayers .....
I wished the couple a pleasant time on the golf course and a safe return home.
I am thinking while Harris will continue to defend Israel, she will begin to reduce the number of offensive munitions Israel will receive.
Like everything else, she has to be elected first, but this is the tone.
Historically US administrations have been rather more restrained than the Biden one, it remains to be seen whether things are likely to change under Harris/Walz.
But the question was posed as an absolute rather than a relative one.
I find myself cautiously optimistic today, too. That’s primarily based on how it seems the Harris and Trump campaigns have been behaving and reacting over the last few days (including here in North Carolina). There seems to be more confidence in the Harris campaign and less confidence in the Trump campaign.
Or that could totally be my imagination, aka wishful thinking.
As I said, it’s cautious optimism. Lord knows, there have been plenty of elections in the past where my optimism was totally unfounded.
US foreign policy always sucks, and people always suffer as a result. From one administration to the next the differences are in the degree of suckage and sometimes who in particular suffers. The only time I think I've factored in foreign policy in choosing a candidate was in the 2008 presidential primary, when I went with Obama instead of H. Clinton because she had voted for the war and he had spoken against it. Obama didn't close the detention camp at Guantanamo, conducted drone strikes in Pakistan and Yemen, including on civilians, and sent bunker buster bombs to Israel. And didn't exactly cover himself in glory with how he handled Syria. And other shit I'm just not remembering at the moment.
From your lips to the nonexistent god's ear.
Voteing can be stressful. I will be home at #34 on Tuesday, Wednesday, and Thursday with a cup of tea and a listening ear for anyone who needs to decompress, no matter who you voted for. We are neighbors and in this together.
We think that’s a very apt way to describe how we feel.
That is good.
BTW, my Pilates instructor and her family have recently come back from a visit to Disneyland Florida, and she remarked on how polarised the US seems to be...
Last night, the final polls had him at 47%.
Story of his life.
AIUI, it may take a day or two for the result to be definitively declared.
Yes. I used the word definitively, as the Guardian here reports that Trump is being advised to declare victory early...
That point was indeed made!
before), and then deal with whatever in the morning.
*Survived, but not without a lot of damage and injustice that we still haven’t truly recovered from.
And a defeat for human hopes and decency.
To our prayers, brothers and sisters, time to show our courage and fortitude!
This. God help us all 🕯️
Yes, and a criminal in the White House.
A substantial win for demagoguery and crime.
"The World".
It's a pretty big thing, to be sure, but at least it's only one thing.
I dunno, the Sentinelese might make it through largely unscathed.
Hmmmm ..... courage, shipmates, courage!
It's going to be worse this time.
When I woke up at 4:30 am? Yup. Long list.
From what friends in NZ are telling me their current government isn't exactly a ray of sunshine either. Currently trying to tear up the treaty with the Maori.
They die.