While there is antidotal evidence to the contrary, over-all immigrants are not a threat to western culture. They assimilate over time, often they contribute to cultural renewal, and they are incubators for small business development.
I have a truly terrifying collection of anecdotes that American white people suck. And I am one.
Surely that's racist.
Or does racism not apply to white people?
Is that a rhetorical question aimed at scoring political points? Or is it an earnest request for information?
I'd like to respond, but my response depends on the intent. And online, it's very hard to read intent.
Should Muslims be excluded from western culture? No! Exclusion based on religion violated the core democratic value Western societies claim to uphold--freedom of religion, equality under the law and human dignity. Cultures that try to "freeze out" ethnic groups end up becoming brittle. Cultures that integrate newcomers become more resilient.
In the United States Muslims have been here since even before the Revolutionary War. They have long been citizens and voters. They are well represented as doctors, teachers, engineers. They are artists, writers, athletes as well. They are not "outsiders" knocking on the door. They are already woven into the social fabric
Exclusion itself, not the presence of Muslims, would undermine Western culture.
@ChastMastr@Gramps49 actual Irish people from Ireland hate American St Patrick's Day celebrations, because they're generally based on inaccuracies and stereotypes - for a start, Patrick is always Paddy in Ireland, never Patty. I'm not making a judgement either way, but I do think it raises interesting questions about diaspora celebrations and diaspora culture generally. Likewise, Irish people generally view American Halloween as a gross commercialisation of Irish Samhain (pronounced "Sam'un" not like "Sam-hayn").
@WhimsicalChristian as you have required a hosting intervention less than 48 hours on from an admin warning, you will be suspended for two weeks shoreleave.
Yes, many ethnic celebrations in the United States take on characteristics that are not followed in the country of origin. In Mexico Cinco de Mayo marks the Battle of Puebla in which the Mexican Army defeated the French. It is not even a national holiday though. Outside the state of Puebla 5 May is a regular work and school day. Compare that to the US where it becomes a nationwide cultural celebration. It is far more widely celebrated in the US than in Mexico. Corporate marketing is a big driver of Cinco de Mayo in the US.
Likewise, corporate marketing is a big driver of the way St. Patrick's Day is celebrated in the US.
Anyway to make a buck.
BTW, I am sorry I used the feminine name for St Patrick. I know Paddy is the correct masculine name.
@ChastMastr@Gramps49 actual Irish people from Ireland hate American St Patrick's Day celebrations, because they're generally based on inaccuracies and stereotypes - for a start, Patrick is always Paddy in Ireland, never Patty. I'm not making a judgement either way, but I do think it raises interesting questions about diaspora celebrations and diaspora culture generally. Likewise, Irish people generally view American Halloween as a gross commercialisation of Irish Samhain (pronounced "Sam'un" not like "Sam-hayn").
I always thought it was SOW-un?
Regardless, I try to think of the real St. Patrick for his saint’s day myself, and I’m not sure I’ve ever called him Paddy or Patty verbally or mentally. I do try to do some Irish/Irish-inspired food around the day, maybe play some Irish folk music. Every year I buy some Guinness and every year I forget to drink it though sometimes I cook with it.
As for Hallowe’en, I do like the fun stuff (trick or treating, spooky movies, candy) but also the actual spiritual aspects of it, the Eve of All Hallows’ (plus All Saints’ Day and All Souls’ Day/Dia de los Muertos and such).
@ChastMastr@Gramps49 actual Irish people from Ireland hate American St Patrick's Day celebrations, because they're generally based on inaccuracies and stereotypes - for a start, Patrick is always Paddy in Ireland, never Patty. I'm not making a judgement either way, but I do think it raises interesting questions about diaspora celebrations and diaspora culture generally. Likewise, Irish people generally view American Halloween as a gross commercialisation of Irish Samhain (pronounced "Sam'un" not like "Sam-hayn").
And American Chinese food is profoundly different from Chinese Chinese food, ditto American Italian food. Mexicans in Mexico don't celebrate Cinco de Mayo, but it's a big deal in California. The traditions immigrants bring to the US inevitably change after a while. While people abroad get their panties in a bunch about it I don't understand. The Japanese eat strawberry shortcake at Christmas and Christmas Eve is apparently a big date night - this does not affect my own understanding or celebration of Christmas.
What really gets my underwear knotted is the habit of Americans hyphenating. From our perspective, all Americans are wholly American, wherever their ancestors came from, and the claiming of another culture is emetic.
Comments
Is that a rhetorical question aimed at scoring political points? Or is it an earnest request for information?
I'd like to respond, but my response depends on the intent. And online, it's very hard to read intent.
In the United States Muslims have been here since even before the Revolutionary War. They have long been citizens and voters. They are well represented as doctors, teachers, engineers. They are artists, writers, athletes as well. They are not "outsiders" knocking on the door. They are already woven into the social fabric
Exclusion itself, not the presence of Muslims, would undermine Western culture.
@WhimsicalChristian as you have required a hosting intervention less than 48 hours on from an admin warning, you will be suspended for two weeks shoreleave.
Doublethink, Admin
[/Admin]
Likewise, corporate marketing is a big driver of the way St. Patrick's Day is celebrated in the US.
Anyway to make a buck.
BTW, I am sorry I used the feminine name for St Patrick. I know Paddy is the correct masculine name.
I always thought it was SOW-un?
Regardless, I try to think of the real St. Patrick for his saint’s day myself, and I’m not sure I’ve ever called him Paddy or Patty verbally or mentally. I do try to do some Irish/Irish-inspired food around the day, maybe play some Irish folk music. Every year I buy some Guinness and every year I forget to drink it though sometimes I cook with it.
As for Hallowe’en, I do like the fun stuff (trick or treating, spooky movies, candy) but also the actual spiritual aspects of it, the Eve of All Hallows’ (plus All Saints’ Day and All Souls’ Day/Dia de los Muertos and such).
It is. mh in Irish and Scots Gaelic is either a w or v sound, depending on context. It's never an m sound.
And American Chinese food is profoundly different from Chinese Chinese food, ditto American Italian food. Mexicans in Mexico don't celebrate Cinco de Mayo, but it's a big deal in California. The traditions immigrants bring to the US inevitably change after a while. While people abroad get their panties in a bunch about it I don't understand. The Japanese eat strawberry shortcake at Christmas and Christmas Eve is apparently a big date night - this does not affect my own understanding or celebration of Christmas.