That's very hard. You have remember you're addressing essentially dream logic in which unconscious content surfaces and creates narratives.
Trying to enforce real life (No, your wife is not somewhere in the flat, but dead) is just distressing. You have somehow to reach the fear behind the story and soothe it.
I'm sure that's the right approach. At this stage, facts almost don't matter any more. But the anxiety symptoms are very real and it is those that need addressing.
One of my early memories of Dad, when I was about 6, was of him sitting me down for a Serious Talk. I must have said something which worried him, because he told me I must never try to have the Sight. He said the Sight is a burden to be borne, not a gift to be sought.
I don't have the Sight, but I've got a sense for what might be called thin places. That sense fuelled a childhood fascination for history, and now I can't tell what is academic knowledge and what is intuition.
My mother believed in the Sight; my grandfather had apparently appeared to her cousin after death, and she believed my twin cousins, and myself and my twin brother, had ESP. As a child I was regaled with stories of how I fell asleep when my twin was having surgery on his eyes. I was a sensitive, emotional child with a heightened awareness of atmosphere (bipolar disorder here we come) and it was insinuated that I had the Sight.
What I do have is a great heap of intuition with a large side helping of empathy - which is great for being a nurse/teaching nursing students (and like you I have a history degree and am fascinated by people). As a young adult my mother sought me out for discussing difficult subjects despite being the youngest child of 8. And by difficult subjects I mean 'Was I right to tell the ambulance men not to resuscitate your father?
Thinking about this, my bipolar disorder might have singled me out in the past as someone with the Sight. And would possibly have got me burnt as a witch.
Oh dear, trying to do the best for their mother is causing falling outs among my husband and three siblings. His younger brother has been her carer for years, but now she needs far more care than one person can give. He's hauled his younger sister in to help, but she is very nearly at carer burn out over it. This caused her to fall out with older sister as she felt older sister was implying that she'd chosen to be a carer for her mother, when in fact she felt she had no choice but to do it. Husband managed to mediate between them, and the three of them have come up with a plan to get more outside care in for their mother that they thought their brother had agreed to. There is going to be a zoom meeting tonight to discuss it. Brother now feels he is being pressured (all three have texted him today) into agreeing to things he doesn't want so he isn't going to be there, though he's agreed that they can get in a carer first thing in the morning if the others are there to get their mum used to it. My mother in law is at the stage of really needing twenty-four hour care so any plan is going to have to ramp up pretty quickly. I feel like I'm watching a car crash and as my mother in law is one of my favourite people it is just so sad.
Hope everyone else's aged Ps are OK. How's your dad doing @North East Quine ? My mum seems to be doing OK in her care home, but of course I haven't seen her for weeks due to various covid restrictions.
Dad is doing well, thanks, @Sarasa. We are just back from our weekly visit. He was told he had "two or three months, maybe more" on 22 Sept, so we reach the two months tomorrow. Mum is starting to think the doctor got it wrong, but I am mindful of @Cathcats wise advice, and think the doctor will probably turn out to be correct. Although he seems "well" and is not on any form of painkillers, Dad is clearly tired - he's getting up later, going to bed earlier, and his post-lunch nap is extending, too. I'm phoning for a chat every day at 4pm - after his nap, and before dinner and bed.
He's remaining positive and, when we're there, cheerful. We're laughing a lot together. My brother is struggling more than I am - Dad thinks it's because my brother is an atheist, so it's more final for him than it is for me, and also that atheists don't have the "structure" for grieving the dying that Christians have.
I've just told my parents that I'm not happy about the idea of gathering at Christmas, given that they live in Coventry which is in Tier 3. I'm not sure how this will go down, but I couldn't pretend to be thrilled to be going from isolation to a large family gathering for three days in such a circumstance.
Master S's Lovely Wife's Nanny died yesterday (his mother-in-law's mother and the last of all their grandparents). She was in her 80s and the family had been arguing among themselves about what level of care she needed. They'd just got carers organised to come in daily, when she had a fall, went to hospital and caught Covid.
I am appalled to say that my main focus of concern is that the funeral arrangements should not interfere with our Christmas ones, which I know is horribly selfish, but we haven't got together with them since the beginning of September and I miss them so much. Also, Intrepid Grandson #2, who lives nearby and is in a childcare support bubble with us, loves to watch little video clips of the Little Welsh Cousin and I should love them to be able to meet now they are getting to be real people.
Oh well, it will be what it will be, and I am sincerely sorry for the Lovely MiL and her family...
Sorry to hear about your daughter in law's nanny @The Intrepid Mrs S. I had this horrible feeling at the beginning of the pandemic that Cummings et al weren't too bothered if a load of elderly people died, and they seem to have succeeded to a degree.
My husband and his siblings managed to have a civilised zoom meeting where they thrashed out an action plan to help their mother. My brother in law's main objection was the company they used for care previously in the past. A new company has been signed up and will be starting with one visit a day to my mother in law shortly. She is very unhappy about this, but it is essential that it happens as her needs are now too great for the family, specially as younger sister is now off work sick having totally burned out. The idea is that these will ramp up to three or four visits a day very quickly.
My husband is going over tomorrow for a few days to do some much needed DIY and then probably the week after to help his mother get used to carers.
I've just told my parents that I'm not happy about the idea of gathering at Christmas, given that they live in Coventry which is in Tier 3. I'm not sure how this will go down, but I couldn't pretend to be thrilled to be going from isolation to a large family gathering for three days in such a circumstance.
Pray for me..........................
It went down better than expected. I'm finding my parents totally unpredictable at the moment, but I'm grateful for this unexpected ease. This probably won't last, so I'll enjoy it while it is.
I've just told my parents that I'm not happy about the idea of gathering at Christmas, given that they live in Coventry which is in Tier 3. I'm not sure how this will go down, but I couldn't pretend to be thrilled to be going from isolation to a large family gathering for three days in such a circumstance.
Pray for me..........................
It went down better than expected. I'm finding my parents totally unpredictable at the moment, but I'm grateful for this unexpected ease. This probably won't last, so I'll enjoy it while it is.
@Sarasa I do hope that all works out well. It seems so hard that having been so stressed about your own mother, you should now have all this to contend with - I'm not sure Mr S appreciated how lucky we were to have only one to worry about. Is your mother settled now?
Nanny's funeral will be outside in Wales (so, by definition, on a wet hillside) next Saturday - because, I suppose, she isn't being cremated, it can be done more quickly. Then everyone turns round and drives home, having no desire to go indoors, and it will be too cold to stand around outside. A 15 minute service doesn't seem much of a celebration of such a long life.
But then our part of the family is going to quarantine itself until they come here, so all should be well *phew*
I've just lost my remaining AP - I heard this morning that David's mum died last night; she'd been suffering from Alzheimer's and had had a fall a couple of weeks ago and broken her hip. Although they'd sent her back to the care-home, I don't think she really properly recovered, as she was taken back to hospital a few days ago, and then sent back with "end-of-life" measures, and died peacefully in her sleep. She was 91; she'd had a good long innings, and will now be reunited with L., her husband, and with David (who she didn't know had died - David's sister decided it would be too upsetting for her if in fact she could understand, and if she couldn't, it would be upsetting to have to keep telling her over and over again. I think she made the right decision).
4 months since my father died, and I'm sorting papers. Among them letters between my mother (who died on the exact same date as he 11 years earlier) and him. From before I was born almost 70 years ago. I knew that her mother and his father died within 2 days of each other, and they had gone to separate funerals in separate cities 3000 miles east and 500 miles from each other, and we children were farmed out for a few weeks.
Love is the way you guys. What ever else goes down:
Grousing over my parents' failure to let us know my mother broke her hip on Thanksgiving and had surgery on Friday. For fucks sake, there were four people at Thanksgiving, any one of whom could have dropped us a text. This stinks of "oh, don't tell anyone, promise me you won't" which is a tactic my mother has favored for years. None of her children knew till Sunday.
Thank you. I do too, but I fear we are in for a difficult time. She takes rather a strong interest in her various medical issues, and occasionally weaponizes them...
Just had an upset husband on the phone. He is staying with his mum and feels very guilty about coming home tomorrow as he feels she should no longer be on her own. His brother had been very against care coming in, but had agreed to carers staring next week for one session a day to build up to three. The company now say they can't take on the work, so it's back to square one on that. Husband thinks his mother really needs to be in a home, as she no longer knows her way round the house and has to be guided to sit down or pick up cutlery. I'm not sure what to advise him to do.
Oh Sarasa, that's a rotten situation, but if your m-i-l is having difficulty finding her way around the house, I'd have thought it was definitely time to look for something more full-on. Even part-time care wouldn't really cut the mustard, would it?
Just got off the phone with my mom, and for once decided NOT to dance around the cowpat and just ask straight out: "Why did you all wait four days to let me know about the accident and surgery?" (I had a morbid curiosity as to what she'd say, as it's never what you'd expect.) I got told in quick succession that a) she told everybody not to tell me, b) she didn't want to bring back memories of my sister's cancer at the holidays (! ?), c) she was busy getting in the ambulance, d) her phone was at 13%, e) my stepfather had to take care of a sick dog, f) you couldn't do anything about it, and g) "You weren't my first priority, LC!"
Yeah, that's kind of obvious. Nor fifth, nor seventh, nor twelfth...
She then proceeded to inquire minutely into whether I was catching coronavirus from my son, who came home to be nursed back to health well after the contagious period.
@Sarasa tell your husband to call Social Services, the emergency number. If your mother-in-law is not under their care and they refuse, ring the doctors surgery, tell them the true state of play and they will ring social services, they are legally obliged to. Seriously if she needs that sort of care then it is 24/7 and you at least need a live in carer plus your husbands brother. When crises like this happen Social Services can arrange emergency respite care which will give your husbands family time to sort out long term care arrangements. I know it is hard to do this, but sometimes it has to be done. We had to do this at least twice on Dad when he was caring for Mum and the second time there was no way he could continue caring for Mum. Both times when it was Social Services saying "this must be done" he accepted it far better than if my sister or I said anything.
Now I think about it, when David's mum had a fall the summer before last, she was taken into a rehab / assessment / respite place and stayed there while they decided what was best for her. That turned out to be staying in the same facility, which also had full-time paying patients, and she was there until she died.
@Lamb Chopped your mum isn’t short of an answer is she? Hope she’s back on her feet very soon. @Jengie Jon , I think my husband needs to do what you’ve suggested, but doing that will lead to major falling out with at least two of his siblings, including his brother who is their mother’s main carer. Brother needs to see it’s his mother’s needs rather than wants that matter now. I just feel I’m watching the car crash happen.
My Godmother had dementia for a few years before she died, on top of other physical issues that made it hard look after herself on her own. Her son managed to get her into residential care by suggesting she go to the same place as her husband (who had terminal cancer) for a while, and review it after his death. By the time he passed away she was settled enough that she was happy to stay there.
Sarasa, should you need to involve the powers that be, do not accept NO for an answer. If my friend's mother's GP's receptionist had been prepared to act when he went round five times for help when she had trashed her gas cooker, instead of saying she had been well at her visit the week before, and sounded all right on the phone, the last few years would have been very, very different. She didn't have a visit, and they did not call in social services. (And if they thought my friend was lying about her condition, that should have alerted them to a need for social services, anyway.)
Holding you in my thoughts.
Thanks everyone. Husband said leaving her today was like abandoning a toddler. I hope his siblings see that leaving her alone for most the day isn't in her best interests. He had to leave the lights on before he left as she appears to have forgotten how to do it for herself.
@Lamb Chopped your mum isn’t short of an answer is she? Hope she’s back on her feet very soon. @Jengie Jon , I think my husband needs to do what you’ve suggested, but doing that will lead to major falling out with at least two of his siblings, including his brother who is their mother’s main carer. Brother needs to see it’s his mother’s needs rather than wants that matter now. I just feel I’m watching the car crash happen.
When we did it we were highly worried that it would alienate my Dad, Mum's carer. In actual fact once they were involved he almost seemed relieved that professionals were saying this could not go on. He never really accepted Mum being in care and I think it was always until he was better. However, every time he had a good visit to see Mum he wondered about getting back home with her. It took barely five minutes to remind him of the reality was like and then he was back to being sensible but I think he treasured the hope right up to the end that they would get back together again.
Well things have moved on. Brother has now admitted his mother needs to be in a care home as do older sister and my husband. Younger sister would rather they went down the live in carer's route, but the house isn't suitable, and the building work required to make it so would mean their mother moving out while it was done anyway.
Elder sister spent a long time explaining the situation to local social services, and they'll be visiting shortly. Husband is feeling rather stressed by it all, not least the trying to keep everyone talking to each other.
Dad was told he had "2-3 months, maybe more" and that he "might see Christmas, but probably not" on 22 Sept. We're now 11 weeks in. Dad has been "well" so far, till Tuesday, when he started to feel very ill. He was told he'd get a home visit from the doctor on Wednesday.
On Wednesday morning he phoned me, very cheerful, and said that he thought that having to be up, washed and smartly dressed, to be "presentable" for the doctor's visit had actually pepped him up. He does get up, showered and dressed every morning, but put an extra effort to look smart yesterday. Oh, the relief, to hear him sounding cheery! I hadn't realised how tense I was till all the tension drained away!
I don't know how Mum is coping - that "2-3 months" is hanging over us all, but Mum especially. Dad keeps saying that he's outlasted the "two months" and plans to outlast the "three months" although he's also saying that he doesn't want to blight future Christmases by dying on Christmas Eve / Christmas Day / Boxing Day.
Your father sounds an amazing man @North East Quine, and very thoughtful about the rest of you. I hope your mother is doing OK with it all too.
Things are not going great with husband's family. Social services are supposed to be doing an assessment today but the four of them are falling out about the best way forward. I'm hoping any decisions are taken out of their hands.
Sarasa, having a professional tell you that <this> is the only, or even the best way forward, can make such a difference. Sadly for your younger sister-in-law's plan, the costs of a live-in carer are comparable to that of a respectable care home. My fear would be that the same would happen as to the AP of a friend - they moved heaven and earth to get alterations done to her house, and she then decided she couldn't stay there after all! If the AP has to move into care during building work, moving her back again into a house that isn't exactly what she is used to (I won't say 'that she remembers') is not going to help her state of mind, I'm afraid.
After the Dowager's catastrophic fall, the occupational therapist wanted me to get rid of the rug on the parquet floor in the hall. I refused, on the grounds that it had been there 50 years and the Dowager would fall over where it wasn't!
On a lighter note, do y'all remember me getting planning permission for a bungalow in the garden of her house, to increase the value of the property? Well, I went back to check the link for a friend who'd helped with the drawings, and in the process discovered another application - for a mammoth extension (yes, you could keep elephants in it!) to the side. Anyone who watches 'Ugly House to Lovely House' will know just what I mean <gogglyeyes>.
Thanks @Ethne Alba and @The Intrepid Mrs S . I don't want to say too much on a public forum but things have the potential to turn into a major, never talk to each other again, rift between the four of them. My mother in law is one of my favourite people and I like all my in-laws. I hate to see them falling out so badly. I just hope something is put into place very soon.
The house we are hopefully buying has an extension to the side. It's one of a pair of semi detached houses, and looking at it's neighbour the extension has actually improved the look. It'll be interesting to make a detour past it in a year or two @The Intrepid Mrs S and see what it looks like in the flesh.
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I'm sure that's the right approach. At this stage, facts almost don't matter any more. But the anxiety symptoms are very real and it is those that need addressing.
What I do have is a great heap of intuition with a large side helping of empathy - which is great for being a nurse/teaching nursing students (and like you I have a history degree and am fascinated by people). As a young adult my mother sought me out for discussing difficult subjects despite being the youngest child of 8. And by difficult subjects I mean 'Was I right to tell the ambulance men not to resuscitate your father?
Thinking about this, my bipolar disorder might have singled me out in the past as someone with the Sight. And would possibly have got me burnt as a witch.
Hope everyone else's aged Ps are OK. How's your dad doing @North East Quine ? My mum seems to be doing OK in her care home, but of course I haven't seen her for weeks due to various covid restrictions.
He's remaining positive and, when we're there, cheerful. We're laughing a lot together. My brother is struggling more than I am - Dad thinks it's because my brother is an atheist, so it's more final for him than it is for me, and also that atheists don't have the "structure" for grieving the dying that Christians have.
Pray for me..........................
I am appalled to say that my main focus of concern is that the funeral arrangements should not interfere with our Christmas ones, which I know is horribly selfish, but we haven't got together with them since the beginning of September and I miss them so much. Also, Intrepid Grandson #2, who lives nearby and is in a childcare support bubble with us, loves to watch little video clips of the Little Welsh Cousin and I should love them to be able to meet now they are getting to be real people.
Oh well, it will be what it will be, and I am sincerely sorry for the Lovely MiL and her family...
My husband and his siblings managed to have a civilised zoom meeting where they thrashed out an action plan to help their mother. My brother in law's main objection was the company they used for care previously in the past. A new company has been signed up and will be starting with one visit a day to my mother in law shortly. She is very unhappy about this, but it is essential that it happens as her needs are now too great for the family, specially as younger sister is now off work sick having totally burned out. The idea is that these will ramp up to three or four visits a day very quickly.
My husband is going over tomorrow for a few days to do some much needed DIY and then probably the week after to help his mother get used to carers.
It went down better than expected. I'm finding my parents totally unpredictable at the moment, but I'm grateful for this unexpected ease. This probably won't last, so I'll enjoy it while it is.
So pleased to hear this, it must be a relief!
Nanny's funeral will be outside in Wales (so, by definition, on a wet hillside) next Saturday - because, I suppose, she isn't being cremated, it can be done more quickly. Then everyone turns round and drives home, having no desire to go indoors, and it will be too cold to stand around outside. A 15 minute service doesn't seem much of a celebration of such a long life.
But then our part of the family is going to quarantine itself until they come here, so all should be well *phew*
RIP Nora.
Love is the way you guys. What ever else goes down:
It's just fact.
Bah, humbug.
Just got off the phone with my mom, and for once decided NOT to dance around the cowpat and just ask straight out: "Why did you all wait four days to let me know about the accident and surgery?" (I had a morbid curiosity as to what she'd say, as it's never what you'd expect.) I got told in quick succession that a) she told everybody not to tell me, b) she didn't want to bring back memories of my sister's cancer at the holidays (! ?), c) she was busy getting in the ambulance, d) her phone was at 13%, e) my stepfather had to take care of a sick dog, f) you couldn't do anything about it, and g) "You weren't my first priority, LC!"
Yeah, that's kind of obvious. Nor fifth, nor seventh, nor twelfth...
She then proceeded to inquire minutely into whether I was catching coronavirus from my son, who came home to be nursed back to health well after the contagious period.
The irony, it burns.
@Jengie Jon , I think my husband needs to do what you’ve suggested, but doing that will lead to major falling out with at least two of his siblings, including his brother who is their mother’s main carer. Brother needs to see it’s his mother’s needs rather than wants that matter now. I just feel I’m watching the car crash happen.
FWIW, ........oh there is nothing sensible I can say .....except that we are All Praying.
Merciful Lord
Good grief, @Lamb Chopped, words fail me!
Holding you in my thoughts.
When we did it we were highly worried that it would alienate my Dad, Mum's carer. In actual fact once they were involved he almost seemed relieved that professionals were saying this could not go on. He never really accepted Mum being in care and I think it was always until he was better. However, every time he had a good visit to see Mum he wondered about getting back home with her. It took barely five minutes to remind him of the reality was like and then he was back to being sensible but I think he treasured the hope right up to the end that they would get back together again.
Elder sister spent a long time explaining the situation to local social services, and they'll be visiting shortly. Husband is feeling rather stressed by it all, not least the trying to keep everyone talking to each other.
Dad was told he had "2-3 months, maybe more" and that he "might see Christmas, but probably not" on 22 Sept. We're now 11 weeks in. Dad has been "well" so far, till Tuesday, when he started to feel very ill. He was told he'd get a home visit from the doctor on Wednesday.
On Wednesday morning he phoned me, very cheerful, and said that he thought that having to be up, washed and smartly dressed, to be "presentable" for the doctor's visit had actually pepped him up. He does get up, showered and dressed every morning, but put an extra effort to look smart yesterday. Oh, the relief, to hear him sounding cheery! I hadn't realised how tense I was till all the tension drained away!
I don't know how Mum is coping - that "2-3 months" is hanging over us all, but Mum especially. Dad keeps saying that he's outlasted the "two months" and plans to outlast the "three months" although he's also saying that he doesn't want to blight future Christmases by dying on Christmas Eve / Christmas Day / Boxing Day.
Things are not going great with husband's family. Social services are supposed to be doing an assessment today but the four of them are falling out about the best way forward. I'm hoping any decisions are taken out of their hands.
Sadly that proved to be totally impossible and precipitated an admission to Local Official Assessment Centre.........totally confusing AP.
But that Did get to the bottom of the problem, which was galloping Parkinsonianism and Vascular Dementia.
AP had been masking and covering up for ages. The assessment process uncovered so very much that we had just missed.
Prayers for wisdom
Sarasa, having a professional tell you that <this> is the only, or even the best way forward, can make such a difference. Sadly for your younger sister-in-law's plan, the costs of a live-in carer are comparable to that of a respectable care home. My fear would be that the same would happen as to the AP of a friend - they moved heaven and earth to get alterations done to her house, and she then decided she couldn't stay there after all! If the AP has to move into care during building work, moving her back again into a house that isn't exactly what she is used to (I won't say 'that she remembers') is not going to help her state of mind, I'm afraid.
After the Dowager's catastrophic fall, the occupational therapist wanted me to get rid of the rug on the parquet floor in the hall. I refused, on the grounds that it had been there 50 years and the Dowager would fall over where it wasn't!
On a lighter note, do y'all remember me getting planning permission for a bungalow in the garden of her house, to increase the value of the property? Well, I went back to check the link for a friend who'd helped with the drawings, and in the process discovered another application - for a mammoth extension (yes, you could keep elephants in it!) to the side. Anyone who watches 'Ugly House to Lovely House' will know just what I mean <gogglyeyes>.
The house we are hopefully buying has an extension to the side. It's one of a pair of semi detached houses, and looking at it's neighbour the extension has actually improved the look. It'll be interesting to make a detour past it in a year or two @The Intrepid Mrs S and see what it looks like in the flesh.