Not a good time for the Conservative government in the UK

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  • Telford wrote: »
    IMHO you're putting it rather mildly...anyway, he's on the Waste of Oxygen thread, for suggesting that the firefighters are objecting to the potential death trap prison ship for political reasons...
    :grimace:
    His argument was reasonable because it was Fire Brigade Union that objected.

    Rubbish. The FBU is made up of human beings, who are just as liable to be killed in a fire as any other person, even those Horrid Foreign Illegal People...
    Telford wrote: »
    IMHO you're putting it rather mildly...anyway, he's on the Waste of Oxygen thread, for suggesting that the firefighters are objecting to the potential death trap prison ship for political reasons...
    :grimace:
    His argument was reasonable because it was Fire Brigade Union that objected.

    In its capacity of representing its workers professional interests.

    The FBU is taking legal action against the Home Secretary:

    https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2023/aug/27/braverman-plan-to-house-uk-asylum-seekers-on-bibby-stockholm-barge-faces-legal-hurdle
  • CameronCameron Shipmate
    I finally steeled myself to read the Dorries resignation letter. It is eviscerating. Here is a small sample:

    “Levelling up has been discarded and with it, those deprived communities it sought to serve. Social care, ready to be launched, abandoned along with the hope of all of those who care for the elderly and the vulnerable. The Online Safety Bill has been watered down. BBC funding reform, the clock run down. The Mental Health Act, timed out. Defence spending, reduced. Our commitment to net zero, animal welfare and the green issues so relevant to the planet and voters under 40, squandered. As Lord Goldsmith wrote in his own resignation letter, because you simply do not care about the environment or the natural world.”

    With the full letter available here

    All of the critique would be even more effective if there wasn’t an unspoken subtext of “…but I wouldn’t have made a fuss about any of these massive failures if I’d been made a Baroness”
  • DoublethinkDoublethink Admin, 8th Day Host
    To be fair, it’s a better letter than I expected from her.
  • Is that perhaps because much of what she says appears to be true?
  • Is that perhaps because much of what she says appears to be true?

    Well, she has done reasonably well financially from her novels, even if they tend towards a somewhat florid style.
  • TelfordTelford Shipmate
    Telford wrote: »
    IMHO you're putting it rather mildly...anyway, he's on the Waste of Oxygen thread, for suggesting that the firefighters are objecting to the potential death trap prison ship for political reasons...
    :grimace:
    His argument was reasonable because it was Fire Brigade Union that objected.

    In its capacity of representing its workers professional interests.

    The experts within the Fire Brigade declared that it was fit for use.
  • Telford wrote: »
    Telford wrote: »
    IMHO you're putting it rather mildly...anyway, he's on the Waste of Oxygen thread, for suggesting that the firefighters are objecting to the potential death trap prison ship for political reasons...
    :grimace:
    His argument was reasonable because it was Fire Brigade Union that objected.

    In its capacity of representing its workers professional interests.

    The experts within the Fire Brigade declared that it was fit for use.

    Link, please. What experts?

    Read this link, and tell me where it says that the FBU is happy with the barge:

    https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2023/aug/27/braverman-plan-to-house-uk-asylum-seekers-on-bibby-stockholm-barge-faces-legal-hurdle
  • CameronCameron Shipmate
    Is that perhaps because much of what she says appears to be true?

    Well, she has done reasonably well financially from her novels, even if they tend towards a somewhat florid style.

    Yikes, that review of her books makes me immediately want to read none of them.

    I like the quotation from Abir Mukherjee, who commented:

    “Calling Nadine Dorries an author is like saying cannibal Jeffrey Dahmer was a chef.”

    Mind you, I can see a line between her novel writing (As reviewed) and this description of Mr Sunak in her resignation letter:

    “You flashed your gleaming smile in your Prada shoes and Savile Row suit from behind a camera, but you just weren't listening.”

    Her forthcoming political memoir might actually be entertaining in parts, especially if you have a taste for schadenfreude…
  • Yes, poor old Sushi and his short trousers...not exactly a glowing tribute.

    I doubt if either of the two main opposition parties will manage to wrest True-Blue Mid-Beds from the dying grip of the tories, but one never knows.
  • ArethosemyfeetArethosemyfeet Shipmate, Heaven Host
    Yes, poor old Sushi and his short trousers...not exactly a glowing tribute.

    I doubt if either of the two main opposition parties will manage to wrest True-Blue Mid-Beds from the dying grip of the tories, but one never knows.

    The SNP are, I assume, not standing, so no chance of the third largest party in parliament taking the seat.
  • Yes, poor old Sushi and his short trousers...not exactly a glowing tribute.

    I doubt if either of the two main opposition parties will manage to wrest True-Blue Mid-Beds from the dying grip of the tories, but one never knows.

    The SNP are, I assume, not standing, so no chance of the third largest party in parliament taking the seat.

    Hehe...no, I don't suppose the SNP will get involved. Still, it would make for an interesting contest.

    I accept your admonition and correction with grace, though.
  • Cameron wrote: »
    This article in the Independent provides a handy summary of Ms Dorries' biggest gaffes.

    History will not judge her kindly, but she does leave a gap in political life... for the most gaffe-prone Tory. I wonder who gets the title now?

    There are planty who have been preparing themselves for the vacancy.
  • To be fair, it’s a better letter than I expected from her.

    I think many of the points she makes are narrowly valid but she lacks the interest/nous to understand why. For instance, she complains that the 2019 manifesto was discarded, and of course it was, because 'leveling up' and '40 new hospitals' were things that were only useful to portray as being universally good and a break with the previous administrations for the period it took to win in 2019. She complains that Johnson was stitched up by the press and Tory MPs, and of course he was because until then it suited them to pretend they hadn't noticed he was a serial liar.
  • DoublethinkDoublethink Admin, 8th Day Host
    True.
  • Bishops FingerBishops Finger Shipmate
    edited August 2023
    This is typical of tories who are leaving the sinking ship - they tend to (conveniently, perhaps?) forget that they have, even if tacitly, been responsible for the chaos and disasters of the past 13 years.

    Dosser Dorries is either too thick, or too arrogant, to realise this. Good riddance to bad rubbish, but I daresay she will continue to entertain Sid & Doris Bonkers, and the other half-dozen viewers, on TalkLiesTV...or whatever Oracle of Gammondom she ends up with.
  • PigletPiglet All Saints Host, Circus Host
    I wonder who wrote her resignation letter for her; as my sister put it, there are words in there that Mad Nad probably wouldn't understand.
  • Bishops FingerBishops Finger Shipmate
    edited August 2023
    O I think it's a standard pro-forma letter, compiled especially for all the tories who are gradually coming to whatever senses they have left - a sense of self-preservation, mostly...
  • Alan Cresswell Alan Cresswell Admin, 8th Day Host
    Ms Dorries is a writer, I believe she found time to write more than a dozen books while working tirelessly as a full-time MP. Any good writer would have an extensive vocabulary to call upon.

  • The operative word here being *good*, of course...
    :naughty:
  • The art of government has become the art of provoking the slow of thought to anger.

    Those critics of democracy in the 18th Century never quite foresaw this. Although they did foresee demagogues leading a deranged mob into folly, which is essentially what Johnson did.

    I never thought I would come to agree with those critics. That being the case, anything is possible. I may yet turn to Rome, or become a fervent monarchist. Life is a learning process - one learns how little one knows in the scheme of things.
  • Bishops FingerBishops Finger Shipmate
    edited August 2023
    Meanwhile, the government continues its war against that horrid Mr Khan on behalf of the poor beleaguered motorist (the London ULEZ extension is operative as from today), Michael Gove plans to scrap water pollution rules for housebuilders, and Sushi Rinak takes a helicopter to Ultima Thule Norwich in order to defend his *green credentials*...

    The satire makes itself up, and it would be funny if it weren't so seriously unfunny IYSWIM.
  • PigletPiglet All Saints Host, Circus Host
    I totally see what you mean BF - they really are the most awful shower, aren't they?
  • One can only hope that the venal, mendacious, incompetent gobshites move into their lovely tropical paradise just as climate change makes it uninhabitable...
  • So having been told 5 years ago that several schools were coming to the end of their life and they need to build more, the government didn’t and now ceilings are falling in. So lots of schools have now been told not to open because it is dangerous
  • Hugal wrote: »
    So having been told 5 years ago that several schools were coming to the end of their life and they need to build more, the government didn’t and now ceilings are falling in. So lots of schools have now been told not to open because it is dangerous

    The weekend before the Autumn Term starts...
  • ArethosemyfeetArethosemyfeet Shipmate, Heaven Host
    Hugal wrote: »
    So having been told 5 years ago that several schools were coming to the end of their life and they need to build more, the government didn’t and now ceilings are falling in. So lots of schools have now been told not to open because it is dangerous

    To make things worse, it appears the Scottish and Welsh governments are not much more on the ball, the former having passed the buck to local authorities, as if they have the expertise or the cash to deal with the problem. Plus, does anyone want to hazard a guess at which places have the most schools with the problematic concrete? I'm going to hazard a guess it's way more likely to be Inverclyde than East Ren.
  • Whilst the crumbling schools are threatening to collapse (rather like the tory government - something of a parable there, I think), Stop-The-Boats Sushi is probably a bit pissed off with this report:

    https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2023/sep/01/monthly-number-people-small-boat-crossing-channel-high



  • Alan Cresswell Alan Cresswell Admin, 8th Day Host
    Why would he be pissed off? His government has done everything they can to increase the number of people crossing the Channel in small boats. Options for safely entering the country have been closed down. They've pulled the UK out of international agreements to cooperate on managing migrants. He's getting exactly what he wants, the "invasion" of "illegal" immigrants, just in time to exploit it to con the gammons into voting Conservative.
  • Ah well - you may have a valid point there...
    :grimace:
  • ArethosemyfeetArethosemyfeet Shipmate, Heaven Host
    I think there does come a point, however, where their inability to deal with the "problem" becomes fuel for the Faragist tendency and actually loses them votes (and it has to be remembered that it was partly the 'kipper vote that kept the red wall red in 2015).
  • I do think the "small boats crisis" which has been deliberately manufactured by Sunak & co is starting to look like a disaster by their inability to have done anything.

    As for schools - I would bet that Eton does not have ceilings crashing in. They should send all the displaced pupils to the local public schools.
  • Their total inability to deal with the *problem* is nowadays blindingly obvious to all but the most wilful Faragist or the most stupid Gammon.
  • DoublethinkDoublethink Admin, 8th Day Host

    As for schools - I would bet that Eton does not have ceilings crashing in. They should send all the displaced pupils to the local public schools.

    On the upside, this is a rare example of not waiting for the disaster to happen (ceiling collapse on classroom full of children) before actually doing something.
  • Lots of cartoonists using the crumbling concrete story as a metaphor for the Tory govt. I agree that the small boats crisis is deliberately engineered, but seems to backfire. I suppose they could blame Labour.
  • Well, to the tories everything going wrong is Labour's fault, but they forget that it's they themselves who have been ruining running the country for the past 13 years...
  • PigletPiglet All Saints Host, Circus Host
    ... it's they themselves who have been ruining running the country ...
    No - you were right first time.
  • chrisstileschrisstiles Hell Host
    edited September 2023
    As for schools - I would bet that Eton does not have ceilings crashing in. They should send all the displaced pupils to the local public schools.

    This was identified back in the 90s, and the then Labour government created the "Building Schools for the Future" programme. This was axed in 2010 by Michael Gove - education secretary at the time, in favour of funding schools started by parents. In the event the UK ended up with insufficient provision to deal with a minor demographic boom, and crumbling buildings.

    This was a predictable expense, and delaying maintenance costs to flatter your top line figure is generally considered to be fairly shady accounting practice.
  • So the PM is also personally responsible for the whole thing, having denied funding to carry out the repairs that had been identified against the BSF:

    https://twitter.com/BBCr4today/status/1698595798445932834
  • Bishops FingerBishops Finger Shipmate
    edited September 2023
    Sushi absolutely denies being responsible, so he probably is...toryspeak being what it is, where words stand on their heads.
  • Alan Cresswell Alan Cresswell Admin, 8th Day Host
    Though, it predates Sunak as chancellor. The rebuilding and repair plan that had been started towards the end of the Brown government, when in the vast majority of cases all that was needed was maintenance of roofing*, was scrapped in 2010.

    * RAAC doesn't spontaneously fail. The cement part is porous and not very strong, it's the reinforcing bars that give strength. RAAC fails when the reinforcement bars corrode - and that happens when water penetrates. If there's no water penetration then the material will last for many decades beyond the 30y design life of the buildings it was used in. The main cause for water penetration is failures in the roof letting water into the building from the top, though general humidity will be a major factor that will also be evident in mould growing on the walls, and then factors like leaking pipes. If the relatively small amount of money needed for a programme of routine building maintenance is spent then there'd be a very low rate of RAAC failure - as well as no damp, functioning plumbing, windows that keep the cold out, paint and plaster not peeling off walls ...
  • Well, OK - but it's all happening on Sushi's watch, and is the responsibility of the party which he purports to lead.

    No doubt the usual toadies and lickspittles will blame Labour, or the French, or refugees...anything and anybody except the tories...
  • DafydDafyd Hell Host
    Hunt has said that the government will fund the repairs. By which he means the money for the repairs will come out of the existing Education budget. Any other expenses like temporary classrooms are up to the local authorities or schools concerned.
  • Though, it predates Sunak as chancellor. The rebuilding and repair plan that had been started towards the end of the Brown government, when in the vast majority of cases all that was needed was maintenance of roofing*, was scrapped in 2010.

    Yes, as I already summarized above.

    Sunak then denied funding intended to fix some of the effects of the cancellation.
  • DoublethinkDoublethink Admin, 8th Day Host
    I feel slightly sorry for Keegan, as she has in fact got off her arse and done something before anyone died - on the other hand, she did support this shower.
  • Yes. Even *good* tories are all tarred with the same brush IYSWIM, and the odious black slime which covers them is impossible to remove.
  • ArethosemyfeetArethosemyfeet Shipmate, Heaven Host
    Yes. Even *good* tories are all tarred with the same brush IYSWIM, and the odious black slime which covers them is impossible to remove.

    ATAB.
  • All Tories Are Besmirched?
    :naughty:
  • To be fair, the Treasury traditionally views all requests for funding by spending departments with exfreme scepticism - sometimes with reason, sometimes, as in the schools case, unwisely.
  • Lots of cartoonists using the crumbling concrete story as a metaphor for the Tory govt. I agree that the small boats crisis is deliberately engineered, but seems to backfire. I suppose they could blame Labour.

    I keep reading this on here but I can't find any evidence of it. If it's the government idea to engineer it, why is it one of their 5 priorities to reduce it.

  • Alan Cresswell Alan Cresswell Admin, 8th Day Host
    The problem is that spending on routine maintenance isn't glamourous. Building something new is politically much better - opportunities to have photos taken shoving a spade in the ground, to parade around a building site in a hi-vis jacket, cut a ribbon, talk about all the millions being spent ... Even though a few grand to get the roof checked out and the gutters cleaned doesn't quite have the political pa-zaz, politicians don't go round getting photos shacking the hand of Richard the Roofer while they get on with the job of preventing big money needing to be spent in the future.
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